@shaggiedo, you obviously care enough as you continue to respond. Hence my last statement. Again keep caring, it shows your positive side. Lol
Brig Discussion - Suggestions on How to Change the Brig
@nunoazuldimeter The point is they have the option of backing out if they lost a friend. I will never do something to just please someone else. Is that stubborn? yes. Do I care? not in the slightest!
I'm failing to see your point in this though. As of today in beta you cannot do that so in my eyes all you seem to be doing is defending your way of gameplay which is practically manipulation into your way of gameplay. Honestly its very childish if i'm being frank with you. It's basically if you don't get what you want then you're not sharing.
Definitely brig needs auto kick after time, which will take care of brig squatters. But loot needs to be tied to crew that actually participated. If you played 2 hours, got loot, friends disconnected, new randoms join and kick you - they dont get any loot from your voyage since they werent there at the time. And if you are in the brig you dont get a share of any loot found while you are in the brig, since you obviously arent helping from in there.
If you get let out of the brig you get loot share from that point on if you behave.This will protect against brig squatters/trolls who are hanging out doing nothing, to get loot share while off watching tv or eating a sandwich.
Better Matchmaking options/lock crew will fix most problems since you wont need to kick immediately if you are waiting for friends, or a friend to reconnect.
But you still need kick option to get rid of toxic crew. Or at least make it so that new crewmembers only get loot share of whatever is collected after the've joined, not before, and get nothing while in the brig.
This situation above with someone brig squatting for 3 hours would not happen if existing team loot was not automatically shared with every random new comer. The crew would have been able to sail to an outpost, drop off their treasure, log out and back in with their disconnected friend, without having to share it with a new random who did nothing.
Or if there was a crew lock, the new player wouldnt have ended up where he/she wasnt wanted in the first place.Personally, I think the brig should be a bit more interactive. Instead of just scrolling through menu's. For example, you physically have to go the the brig and open the gate to let them out. Would be pretty cool. My input here is purely for fun, I know it doesn't really help towards the misuse issue everyone is talking about.
@killa-d1312 said in Brig Discussion - Suggestions on How to Change the Brig:
@poppasquids and what if you join to make a 4 man crew and you guys do a lot of work and do a few voyages and lets say you have done about 2 hours of work and have like 6 chests (good chests) on board and for some reason the 3 players that were here before you are trolls and decide to kick you right before you cash in, then what? now the vote to kick option needs to be tweaked/removed. Its hard to come up with a solution that fits everyone's needs...
@killa-d1312 That argument could go either way. I agree my suggestion isnt perfect but something needs to be in place to save yourself from trolls. If trolls are allowed in and have no way of preventing them then you're screwed.
Maybe not allow Vote to Kick while on a voyage? That way way what you stated cant happen, that specific player cant lose their voyage, and all is well. If you find out someone is a troll 15 min into a voyage, you must cancel it to get rid of him.
After playing through both the alpha and beta I definitely see the brig as a gameplay mechanic rather than a punishment mechanic. I think it would be cool to be able to capture other players trying to steel your loot and place them in the brig. Now the captured players could have a minigame to try and break out of the brig. This obviously would require the vote for brig mechanic to be changed as it was primarily used in my understanding, to deal with trolls in the crew. If that were the case I'd say have a vote to banish from crew and you could walk them off the plank haha.
@dhg-ixxrmacxxi My suggestion would be to add a function to where if you successfully vote someone in the brig, you can only vote a player in the brig once an hour....
That way if that player leaves your crew, and a new player joins, you will essentially be stuck with them. It will force these heathens to be more selective before trolling people with the brig abuse system.
having more crew size options for the ships, make a 4 sail 5-6 man galleon/manowar/frigate/whatever, with one extra canon on each side (compared to regular galleons) options for a 3 man sloop or 3 man galleon (or even some kind of inbetween ship class, like 2, maybe 3, canons each side 2 sails call it a day) basically a more robust ship/crew selection rather than 1 2 or 4. I only say a 5-6 man crew galleon/frigate thinger for larger more fun games with friends cause I'd love to play with a 5 to 6 man ship that has everyone scurrying around doing something. most importantly have the crew selection locked into a player chosen number. the biggest issues seem to come from 3 friends on a 4 man ship with a rando. let the 3 have fun on the galleon on their own if they got the chops or give them something that fits better is my advice. I think this would cut down on the brig abuse to almost nil, then if you find the 3 man that decides they want to grief randos give em suspensions for being nitwits and being toxic.
tl;dr: locked party sizes and more ship options that bridge the gap between sloop and galleon (maybe even a bigger meaner ship as well)
@katttruewalker I love all of these and think they would fit well. for a game that requires robust teamwork, robust team management/incentives are a must have :)
@valegor yep! Once someone goes to the brig a 2nd or 3rd time he should just be kicked aka walk the plank. Where other crew members vote to make the repeated offender walk the plank and he is then kicked from the crew.
I honestly feel that the Brig remain in the game exactly how it is. Sure it can be abused, but so can any Votekicking option. The Brig is a lifesaver when used correctly and usually when you release the player from the Brig, they've had a moment to reflect on what got them there in the first place and hopefully change their behavior. I do feel that if the same player causes trouble again, a Votekicking (walk the plank) option is needed.
The only reason the Brig was abused during the Beta is because private lobby options were not available.
@zanzikahn addition to the redesign of the brig: give the captured member some kind of risk vs reward for staying and allowing themselves to be captured (rather than logging off) like "blood tokens" or some such, these can be used to track a specific ship for a set period of time (so like the last ship's crew that attacked you) something like: "ship x: last seen 3 leagues off of blankety outpost" "rumour has it ship x weighed anchor at blank cove" and have it update every 60 seconds or so. this makes it to where well do I let my old ship sail without for however long or do I just relog/drink me poisoned grog becomes an intense debate. also if you can brig other crew's members make the reward for turning in the captured guy degrade over time until instead of a reward it places a (limited) growing bounty on the ship that has him captured, also the ability to struggle, break away from the bonds (like rock paper scissors qtes) to make grabbing the squirmy rat tough and more rewarding/interactive.
i'm just going to keep it simple
Sloop (1-2)
Gallon (3-4) (just for right now)
this way if you want just 3 you can but i have a better idea just add a new ship between Sloop and gallon
Sloop (1-2)
New ship (3) Caravel?
Gallon (4)the Brig can be left in because it's own there side if they want there friend to join not that person.
Also sidenote this game could use a timelimit if someone gets a disconnect to rejoin like 1-2min before anyone can join or if you started the game to early and was waiting for a friend 1-2min before a random can join as well if xbox can detect your all friends or somthing
My idea…
The fact is the brig problem may only appear when you play the game with « randoms »…
I don’t read every post here but i see many good ideas…
Why can’t we mix them ?The brig can be used as it is, then the player in the brig could have choices to get out (but not to hard if players had put him for « bad reason »).
Let me explain :Firts there must be a coutdown to stop the problem, the discussion and etc…
But ! At the end of countdown player has a choice, stay with the crew and play well and fine, if he pay a certains amount of gold to the crew,
Or ! And to prevent racketee the player choose to be directly sent to the nearest jail (where he or his team mates can pay his « bill »)….And (i’ll continue later)
Thank’s for your attention 😊)
First step: Introduce invite-only mode. This will remove the issues where a crew of 3, waiting for a friend to join or waiting for a friend who disconnected/crashed to rejoin, has a 4th random guy joining... and so they instantly brig him in an attempt to make him leave so their friend can join.
Invite-only groups would resolve that issue.
As for the brig itself; I think it should be a timer thing. Once you are voted into the brig you are there for a set period of time (which can be fine tuned to find the proper time, e.g. 5 mins? 10 mins? 15 mins?).
If someone is in the brig you should be able to vote them out of the brig at any time, even if they still have X minutes left to "serve" on their timer.
I like the way the brig is. If people are abusing it and you are stuck in the brig with no freedom leave and join a new crew. I wouldn't want to play with those fools any way.
I have seen the brig used in fun messing with your buddies ways, and even used as a way to get crew members talking and opening up.
I also believe a kick is also needed and for one reason above all others... Some one can spawn in and leave their Xbox or PC leaving their pirate idle with the others doing voyages and cashing in chests. The player that is absent will gain the same gold and he is just wasting space. I have had this happen to me.
@dhg-ixxrmacxxi maybe a help wanted board, like the looking fo group page on Xbox. That way you can go in and know you are wanted. This could be abused as well but it may help
i am absolutely against vote kick or vote brig'ing a player who's mission is active.
if they put in the gold they should not be able to be kicked. A team that votes for the mission votes for the player.if they kick him...all in progress maps as they stand should go back to the owner.
if the owner drops or quits...well that was the owners problem.
(devs, please add option to return to crew if connection is lost please)I like the idea of a brig timer or even being able to switch it off. i think being able to choose to crew a galleon with only 3 people might solve a lot of this aswell or even being able to lock positions for crew members in the start screen so your fourth slot is never filled. I can see a vote to kick system being abused as much as the brig system is atm. ill be honest its not an issue I've come across personally as i played the beta with friends either on a 2 man or with 3 of us on a galleon and whoever joined the fourth slot didn't stay long. We'd have a long succession of people joining and immediately leaving before finding someone who would stay and play with us 3 weirdos.
@lonegoatknifer said in Brig Discussion - Suggestions on How to Change the Brig:
@krypticninja187 The brig is mostly being used to get people to leave.
I was going off the assumption that someone abused the right and just threw people in there for the heck of it. I understand the concepts of the brig. Yet some gamers just throw people in there for laughs and disrespect. Those gamers should be punished for foul playing.
@krypticninja187 Oh i misread it. I read it as the person getting put in the brig couldn't leave after they got sent there 3 times. If what you said did happen, you would end up with 3 people in the brig.
@dhg-ixxrmacxxi Not sure if this is relevant, but the brig on the sloop seems functionally useless as you cant actually vote someone into the brig with only a 2 man crew. they should probably just get rid of it as its just a waste of space
It would be nice to have a toggle option for matchmaking. Say you join in with a 3 man crew and you toggle matchmaking off so that it locks your crew onto your ship, but you could always toggle matchmaking back on to include a random crew member if you choose so you could run the full 4 man crew. This probably wouldn't serve as a true fix to the problem though, as you would still have grievers who toggle the option on just to troll. I can't imagine that too many people would do that often though.
I have seen the brig used in two ways:
-
When a friend comes online but your crew is already full with 1 random, you brig them so they leave to make room for your friend.
-
Someone is absolutely failing at pirating (steering in the wrong direction and not letting anyone else on the wheel, going afk, etc), or actively sabotaging the crew.
I believe the brig is designed to prevent scenario 2, but not scenario 1. I like the brig. Thematically, it seems really cool. I would actually be interested to see it expanded slightly to include crew members from other ships. If a real pirate boarded another pirate ship, took it over, and wanted to keep everyone restrained while they took all the plunder? They would lock them in the brig of their own ship. I'm not sure how that would be implemented in-game, but it's something to think about.
But to the point of using the brig as a pseudo-kick, the obvious solution is to just implement a "vote to kick" option. The main problem I see with this is that if the person you kick has been with you while you dug up 10 chests, they now lose out on all those chests. Or if they proposed the voyage, they lose their voyage money.
I think the brig is a fine thing to leave in-game just as it is. However, there should be several restrictions on it.
A. There's a time limit on how long you can stay in the brig. If it has been 5 minutes, the crewmember should be let out. The team should be able to re-vote them back in, but they escape after X amount of time. The first time I saw the brig, the guy was in there for like 20 minutes because we put him in the brig and then everyone forgot about him. It might even be interesting to have the person in the brig have the option to attempt to pick the lock. Maybe they could play a little mini-game while in there to pick it, and then get out once they're able to. That would give the brigged person something to do, and not just force them to do nothing while the rest of the crew gets to continue experiencing the game. If you had something to do in the brig, it would at least feel like you were still in the game.
B. If the rest of the crew leaves, you're automatically out of the brig.
C. You still get a cut of the booty when chests are turned in.
D. You can only brig someone who is currently standing on the ship
B, C, and D may already be in the game, I don't actually know. I didn't test the brig extensively. Can you brig somebody in your crew when they're off the ship? If so, that should really be removed, lest it gain traction as a teleport mechanism.
Beyond that, there would need to be some menu option to kick someone, so that people aren't using the brig to kick somebody. I would call it mutiny, to stick with the theme. The problem with kicking somebody is that their hard work goes down the drain. For my money, I say that's part of being a pirate. If your crew stages a mutiny, you're out of luck. Should have found a more loyal crew. There are various mechanisms you might put in place to mitigate that loss if you wanted, but I personally don't think it would be necessary.
To the OP questions:
Would you like it removed altogether and have no way of eliminating a player that you don't want in your crew?
I personally would be fine with this, and it is the simplest and fairest solution to the brig problem. The people who want a player to leave should leave themselves and take the loss of the chests. But again, I do like the brig thematically, so my preference would be that it not be removed.Would you like a 'vote to kick' system that would just remove said person from the crew immediately?
As above, I think having both a brig and a kick feature would be probably the best scenario for me.Will 3-man crew selection work to fix the idea?
No. It will lessen it somewhat, but you don't brig somebody because you have a 3 person crew and you don't want that 4th crewmember around, you brig somebody because you HAD a 3 person crew, and your 4th comes in and you want them to make room.-
I really want to see how much of a problem this continues to be after "empty" crew positions are not automatically filled, I think we'll see a massive drop off in the brig being misused.
Also, for all the negative complaints I've seen about folks bring brigged unfairly and without communication, I've seen little mention of its positive effect. On nearly every occasion that I experienced a random joining our crew they immediately either set sail, altered course, dropped anchor, grabbed chests etc, all without saying a word or responding to us until we threw them in the brig.
I like the current brig system, however I would like the addition of an escape mechanic that maybe gives the player a few minutes to start trying to escape, and if they don't then kicks them from the game. Or a number of times you can be sent to the brig before being forced to the walk the plank, and being kicked out of your crew.
@zanzikahn I would like to see new players start on an island where they can learn to play, rather than be grouped at random at sea. When I first started to play, every time I joined group I was immediately put in the brig for no reason, this is not a way to get new players to buy a game. All group selection should be done on land before a ship sets sail, and once at sea, the players locked to the ship they are on. if a person gets dc there should be a respawn point on the ship. or they have to return to land to recruit another player. All newbs should start on land and be recruited to join a ship. or start out solo with a sloop they have to steal, or stow away. there also needs to be some work done to the chat system, as even though I have a mic, I could not chat with the other players, which is probably why I was put in the brig to begin with.
@mrwhizzards They fixed all that though, no? Within the last scale test, we were able to select 3 man ships and text chat was also available.
My thoughts.
Add the ability to down players and "capture" them. The brig can be used as an actual prison for captured players. They will at all times have the ability to respawn (maybe... add in a "firefly" ;) that you can speak to that will initiate a respawn the same as the mermaid).
The can then build in an actual plank mechanic, where captured enemies are "teleported" to the plank, when a crew member has a pistol pointed at the enemy, it initiates a forced walk off the plank for the captured enemy, who can fight against it (walking backwards, but it won't completely negate the forward momentum).
This gives that captured player the chance to escape if the crew get complacent, or even better, if the captures pirates crew comes back to rescue them (crew stop pointing pistol to fight off invaders, allows the captured enemy to return from the plank, cut bonds and fight).
135 out of 217
