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Man yall complaining I usually get 500 too 700k in like 3 hours doing reapers y'all doing something wrong

@kaoteek said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

Let's not forget that last month's ledgers were artificially inflated by Community week-end. More players, more gold, and so on.

As far as the other ledgers go, GH, OOS and Merchants haven't changed much, they're still doable in a few sessions each, if you know what to do, where, and how.

Same with Athena : a bunch of Veils, skipping the final part if you want to min/max the grind and remain stealthy + the Grade 5 quests, rince/repeat, and you're done in a few sessions.

Reapers, though, is starting to get complicated, esp. if solo. With easier & faster WE, easier FotD, and the Chest of Fortune grind favoring Reapers (FoF has mixed loot : if you play anything but Reapers, you end up losing some gold at some point, whether it selling the CoF at base price because you're flying Athena, or selling Athena loot at grade 1 because you've chosen to fly GH colors... whereas Reapers get all the gold/rep + the commendation for the CoF), and servers back at 6-ships capacity, the seas are full of Reapers, often R5 or about to be, grinding said WE, which makes it tricky to get things done as a solo or duo sloop. Add to that the HG Reapers popping up left and right, and the non-Reaper players fighting among themselves for the few WE not already completed by Reapers, and you get a Reaper ledger that's exploding.

I do agree it's starting to get a bit much, but I don't think it will change anytime soon (then again, it's totally Rare's fault for having CoFs sold at Reaper count for the commendation and the cosmetics grind...).

Merchant has actually been creeping up but not near as fast as Reaper.

Athena is relatively the same.

Let's not forget that last month's ledgers were artificially inflated by Community week-end. More players, more gold, and so on.

As far as the other ledgers go, GH, OOS and Merchants haven't changed much, they're still doable in a few sessions each, if you know what to do, where, and how.

Same with Athena : a bunch of Veils, skipping the final part if you want to min/max the grind and remain stealthy + the Grade 5 quests, rince/repeat, and you're done in a few sessions.

Reapers, though, is starting to get complicated, esp. if solo. With easier & faster WE, easier FotD, and the Chest of Fortune grind favoring Reapers (FoF has mixed loot : if you play anything but Reapers, you end up losing some gold at some point, whether it selling the CoF at base price because you're flying Athena, or selling Athena loot at grade 1 because you've chosen to fly GH colors... whereas Reapers get all the gold/rep + the commendation for the CoF), and servers back at 6-ships capacity, the seas are full of Reapers, often R5 or about to be, grinding said WE, which makes it tricky to get things done as a solo or duo sloop. Add to that the HG Reapers popping up left and right, and the non-Reaper players fighting among themselves for the few WE not already completed by Reapers, and you get a Reaper ledger that's exploding.

I do agree it's starting to get a bit much, but I don't think it will change anytime soon (then again, it's totally Rare's fault for having CoFs sold at Reaper count for the commendation and the cosmetics grind...).

@cfreeman21 said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

Couldn't Agree More @PersonalC0ffee !

There is always room for a rebalance when it come to these systems.

The older the Ledger system becomes the more savvy the gamers will start to play.

Well according to our more savy forumites; it isn't the saviness of the users that's causing it.

Couldn't Agree More @PersonalC0ffee !

There is always room for a rebalance when it come to these systems.

The older the Ledger system becomes the more savvy the gamers will start to play.

@d3adst1ck said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@sweetsandman said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

Looking at the current trend, all that this points to is that we have a much higher player count participating in Emissary activities than normal.

It's always been the top 25%. The rules didn't change. The participation just went up.

These rewards will be current for probably 3 more months. We'll see if this trend continues as the season goes on...but honestly, it seems like a good thing for the game if it does.

Where are you getting data that participation is up? With a little over a week to go there are 100K less participants in the GH ledger than last month (a non-new reward month even). It's possible 100K people could show up in the last week, we'll have to wait and see.

Percentage based systems like this one aren't harder with larger participation - they are easier - because you have a much better chance of being in a higher percentile when there are a bunch more lower participation users in the pool. They are only harder when participation is lower, which makes the numbers in each tier smaller and the margin is razor thin.

So what do you think is causing it?

@personalc0ffee said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

Normally it is 250-400k basically to sit comfortably in the top 25%.

Now we are seeing amounts up into the 600k's and 500k's for some of the trade companies, especially Reaper.

I think something needs to be done. People have lives outside this game. It can take players nearly an entire sailing session of 2 hours to get like 300k emissary value and that's if you're efficient or don't get robbed.

For non consistent players, their only saving grace is you have basically 3 chances in one season to get it but it isn't making it any easier to actually get to these amounts. These amounts are getting too high for non consistent players to obtain.

And please stop doing G&G days during the ending of an active ledger period. It really messed over folks who are struggling to maintain their spots at the end of a ledger month.

Gotta remember HG battles. My reaper is up there this month, but my athena is down.

Keep in mind that is the first month with the new rewards in the ledger, so veterans are more likely to achieve points to get them now.

@sweetsandman said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

Looking at the current trend, all that this points to is that we have a much higher player count participating in Emissary activities than normal.

It's always been the top 25%. The rules didn't change. The participation just went up.

These rewards will be current for probably 3 more months. We'll see if this trend continues as the season goes on...but honestly, it seems like a good thing for the game if it does.

Where are you getting data that participation is up? With a little over a week to go there are 100K less participants in the GH ledger than last month (a non-new reward month even). It's possible 100K people could show up in the last week, we'll have to wait and see.

Percentage based systems like this one aren't harder with larger participation - they are easier - because you have a much better chance of being in a higher percentile when there are a bunch more lower participation users in the pool. They are only harder when participation is lower, which makes the numbers in each tier smaller and the margin is razor thin.

Looking at the current trend, all that this points to is that we have a much higher player count participating in Emissary activities than normal.

It's always been the top 25%. The rules didn't change. The participation just went up.

These rewards will be current for probably 3 more months. We'll see if this trend continues as the season goes on...but honestly, it seems like a good thing for the game if it does.

Unless you believe your average player is getting better (they're not significantly) then this also stems from the general direction of the game in that everything has been made easier. Fofs are so much quicker to complete with more loot.
Flameheart world event is back, and skelly fleets are easier than ever with the same loot reward so it does make sense that the general gold gain will increase.

Perhaps rethink your methods of getting gold, if you rely on the same voyage types that haven't benefitted from the recent changes.

Soloing the skelly fleet used to be a challenge and a roll of the dice depending on what curse ball they had.

With the removal of green curses you can never get weary or jig ball spammed so you always have full control of your character (ship can get anchor balled but more doable)
Fleet adjusts to your crew, you get longer in between rounds and quicker to harpoon the loot with that update

Only threat is players.

@personalc0ffee said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

most of their design decisions revolve around including all players

No. There are a lot of rewards in the game that are extremely grindy and difficult to get.

so why would they want to lock the majority out of the ledger?

Obviously because they want to reserve some rewards for the part of the playerbase that is more dedicated. That's the reason why there are multiple tiers of rewards for the ledgers.

It makes the top tier rewards feel more meaningful instead of them being given out to everybody who has logged on more than once in a month.

Oh no, the average activity for players have risen up greatly...

So what's bad about this, exactly? I'm all for being worried about the requirements increasing, causing room for more sessions dedicated to a trading company, but isn't the point of a certain threshold that's required to be met is to incentivize dedicating more sessions to something?

Like, the threshold for being in the top 25% can't possibly be that alarming past like a few Grade V emissary voyage runs of each trading company (if applicable). We've had 3-4 years since the introduction of the emissary system, several new and unique voyages that gave you a healthy profit, and world events now being easier, which incentivizes (unhealthy) stacking, alongside 2 companies having their emissaries boosted like crazy thanks to the Hourglass system, the seas, and their emissaries, are beyond thriving more than ever, so it's starting to make some sense since Adventure Mode has it's activity restored after the empty wasteland that was Season 7 and 8.

@captain-coel nah man read what a wrote earlier apparently he spells it all out geez

@personalc0ffee said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@captain-coel said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@lackbarwastaken said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@captain-coel I don't see how its fair that 100% of the playerbase can't be in the top 25%!

Im fairly certain this was sarcasm, and it made me smile. Thank you.

@personalc0ffee said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@captain-coel said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@personalc0ffee said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@wolfmanbush said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@coffeelight5545 said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

The reason for this post is because some people have to work harder to earn the emissary ledger rewards. Instead of working harder, they choose to complain.

I was top tier in all of the factions in a couple of days as a solo that strictly plays organically for the new rewards as I did for all ledger rewards that have existed

I wouldn't confuse people's examination and consideration of the shared environment with a lack of willingness to put in the effort or dismiss it as complaining.

Those that struggle should always have their experiences considered no matter how easy or insignificant it is for others.

It's a ladder system in a heavily cheesed environment where the reward is the same and the requirement has essentially doubled. That negatively effects those without connections and without the experience/pvp skill to keep up. That's something to be concerned about and considerate of.

One can say it's an incentive to produce, it's fomo that has been increasing. Season 9 stimulated production in a positive way without making it more difficult for the people mentioned above.

The comment doesn't even make sense. I'm 1 mil emissary in Reaper now but that was a session of FoTD's...ugh

Players also have to remember that Rare specifically told us that they choose the top 25% to make it quite attainable to the majority of the player base and average players. My concern is that is showing signs of slipping away from that initial goal.

We will have to see how ledgers are after the mid next month and reset but I've been noticing them trend upwards more and more except maybe Season 5.

Where did they say that? My recollection was that they expressed it would require commitment throughout the month. There is no way they made it 25% for a majority of players. That sentence is quite contradictory. I also dove through all the info I could find from after and before the release of the Ledger system and couldnt find anything to make me believe that want the average player to be able to get them all done easily. If you could link me those posts, it would be appreciated.

I think it was on the podcast one time, I don't quite remember. But most of their design decisions revolve around including all players so why would they want to lock the majority out of the ledger?

They arent locking them out, they are saying they have to work for it and earn it. They are also infact giving a majority of the players a reward (75%). The rewards are time limited, they can be earned 1 at a time easily.

Yes for now. My concern from the beginning is this is beginning to transition away from that.

The ledger system has existed for nearly 3 years. Why would it change? They continue to give the opportunity for 75% of the player base to earn rewards. I think your concern is unfounded.

@lackbarwastaken said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@personalc0ffee why do you think that they will transition away from not being time limited

That's not what I mean.

Please read the thread.

I've made my concerns very known and why.

@personalc0ffee why do you think that they will transition away from not being time limited

@d3adst1ck It definitely ebbs and flows, and with Season 8, it been all flow man. Personally as a solo casual player, I know I only play enough to get around 800K total Emissary value each month. Thats not very much. So when I see the ledger values skyrocket, I'll just drop it that month and do something else.

I'm only caught up on Merchant Alliance, behind on OoS and GH, and REALLY behind on Reapers and Athena. But do I REALLY need those cosmetics? Not this month.

@captain-coel said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@lackbarwastaken said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@captain-coel I don't see how its fair that 100% of the playerbase can't be in the top 25%!

Im fairly certain this was sarcasm, and it made me smile. Thank you.

@personalc0ffee said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@captain-coel said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@personalc0ffee said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@wolfmanbush said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@coffeelight5545 said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

The reason for this post is because some people have to work harder to earn the emissary ledger rewards. Instead of working harder, they choose to complain.

I was top tier in all of the factions in a couple of days as a solo that strictly plays organically for the new rewards as I did for all ledger rewards that have existed

I wouldn't confuse people's examination and consideration of the shared environment with a lack of willingness to put in the effort or dismiss it as complaining.

Those that struggle should always have their experiences considered no matter how easy or insignificant it is for others.

It's a ladder system in a heavily cheesed environment where the reward is the same and the requirement has essentially doubled. That negatively effects those without connections and without the experience/pvp skill to keep up. That's something to be concerned about and considerate of.

One can say it's an incentive to produce, it's fomo that has been increasing. Season 9 stimulated production in a positive way without making it more difficult for the people mentioned above.

The comment doesn't even make sense. I'm 1 mil emissary in Reaper now but that was a session of FoTD's...ugh

Players also have to remember that Rare specifically told us that they choose the top 25% to make it quite attainable to the majority of the player base and average players. My concern is that is showing signs of slipping away from that initial goal.

We will have to see how ledgers are after the mid next month and reset but I've been noticing them trend upwards more and more except maybe Season 5.

Where did they say that? My recollection was that they expressed it would require commitment throughout the month. There is no way they made it 25% for a majority of players. That sentence is quite contradictory. I also dove through all the info I could find from after and before the release of the Ledger system and couldnt find anything to make me believe that want the average player to be able to get them all done easily. If you could link me those posts, it would be appreciated.

I think it was on the podcast one time, I don't quite remember. But most of their design decisions revolve around including all players so why would they want to lock the majority out of the ledger?

They arent locking them out, they are saying they have to work for it and earn it. They are also infact giving a majority of the players a reward (75%). The rewards are time limited, they can be earned 1 at a time easily.

Yes for now. My concern from the beginning is this is beginning to transition away from that.

@lackbarwastaken said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@captain-coel I don't see how its fair that 100% of the playerbase can't be in the top 25%!

Im fairly certain this was sarcasm, and it made me smile. Thank you.

@personalc0ffee said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@captain-coel said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@personalc0ffee said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@wolfmanbush said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@coffeelight5545 said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

The reason for this post is because some people have to work harder to earn the emissary ledger rewards. Instead of working harder, they choose to complain.

I was top tier in all of the factions in a couple of days as a solo that strictly plays organically for the new rewards as I did for all ledger rewards that have existed

I wouldn't confuse people's examination and consideration of the shared environment with a lack of willingness to put in the effort or dismiss it as complaining.

Those that struggle should always have their experiences considered no matter how easy or insignificant it is for others.

It's a ladder system in a heavily cheesed environment where the reward is the same and the requirement has essentially doubled. That negatively effects those without connections and without the experience/pvp skill to keep up. That's something to be concerned about and considerate of.

One can say it's an incentive to produce, it's fomo that has been increasing. Season 9 stimulated production in a positive way without making it more difficult for the people mentioned above.

The comment doesn't even make sense. I'm 1 mil emissary in Reaper now but that was a session of FoTD's...ugh

Players also have to remember that Rare specifically told us that they choose the top 25% to make it quite attainable to the majority of the player base and average players. My concern is that is showing signs of slipping away from that initial goal.

We will have to see how ledgers are after the mid next month and reset but I've been noticing them trend upwards more and more except maybe Season 5.

Where did they say that? My recollection was that they expressed it would require commitment throughout the month. There is no way they made it 25% for a majority of players. That sentence is quite contradictory. I also dove through all the info I could find from after and before the release of the Ledger system and couldnt find anything to make me believe that want the average player to be able to get them all done easily. If you could link me those posts, it would be appreciated.

I think it was on the podcast one time, I don't quite remember. But most of their design decisions revolve around including all players so why would they want to lock the majority out of the ledger?

They arent locking them out, they are saying they have to work for it and earn it. They are also infact giving a majority of the players a reward (75%). The rewards are time limited, they can be earned 1 at a time easily.

@captain-coel said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@personalc0ffee said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@wolfmanbush said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@coffeelight5545 said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

The reason for this post is because some people have to work harder to earn the emissary ledger rewards. Instead of working harder, they choose to complain.

I was top tier in all of the factions in a couple of days as a solo that strictly plays organically for the new rewards as I did for all ledger rewards that have existed

I wouldn't confuse people's examination and consideration of the shared environment with a lack of willingness to put in the effort or dismiss it as complaining.

Those that struggle should always have their experiences considered no matter how easy or insignificant it is for others.

It's a ladder system in a heavily cheesed environment where the reward is the same and the requirement has essentially doubled. That negatively effects those without connections and without the experience/pvp skill to keep up. That's something to be concerned about and considerate of.

One can say it's an incentive to produce, it's fomo that has been increasing. Season 9 stimulated production in a positive way without making it more difficult for the people mentioned above.

The comment doesn't even make sense. I'm 1 mil emissary in Reaper now but that was a session of FoTD's...ugh

Players also have to remember that Rare specifically told us that they choose the top 25% to make it quite attainable to the majority of the player base and average players. My concern is that is showing signs of slipping away from that initial goal.

We will have to see how ledgers are after the mid next month and reset but I've been noticing them trend upwards more and more except maybe Season 5.

Where did they say that? My recollection was that they expressed it would require commitment throughout the month. There is no way they made it 25% for a majority of players. That sentence is quite contradictory. I also dove through all the info I could find from after and before the release of the Ledger system and couldnt find anything to make me believe that want the average player to be able to get them all done easily. If you could link me those posts, it would be appreciated.

I think it was on the podcast one time, I don't quite remember. But most of their design decisions revolve around including all players so why would they want to lock the majority out of the ledger?

@captain-coel I don't see how its fair that 100% of the playerbase can't be in the top 25%!

@personalc0ffee said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@wolfmanbush said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

@coffeelight5545 said in The amount needed to be in the top 25% for the Emissary Ledger Rewards is starting to trend towards ridiculous.:

The reason for this post is because some people have to work harder to earn the emissary ledger rewards. Instead of working harder, they choose to complain.

I was top tier in all of the factions in a couple of days as a solo that strictly plays organically for the new rewards as I did for all ledger rewards that have existed

I wouldn't confuse people's examination and consideration of the shared environment with a lack of willingness to put in the effort or dismiss it as complaining.

Those that struggle should always have their experiences considered no matter how easy or insignificant it is for others.

It's a ladder system in a heavily cheesed environment where the reward is the same and the requirement has essentially doubled. That negatively effects those without connections and without the experience/pvp skill to keep up. That's something to be concerned about and considerate of.

One can say it's an incentive to produce, it's fomo that has been increasing. Season 9 stimulated production in a positive way without making it more difficult for the people mentioned above.

The comment doesn't even make sense. I'm 1 mil emissary in Reaper now but that was a session of FoTD's...ugh

Players also have to remember that Rare specifically told us that they choose the top 25% to make it quite attainable to the majority of the player base and average players. My concern is that is showing signs of slipping away from that initial goal.

We will have to see how ledgers are after the mid next month and reset but I've been noticing them trend upwards more and more except maybe Season 5.

Where did they say that? My recollection was that they expressed it would require commitment throughout the month. There is no way they made it 25% for a majority of players. That sentence is quite contradictory. I also dove through all the info I could find from after and before the release of the Ledger system and couldnt find anything to make me believe that want the average player to be able to get them all done easily. If you could link me those posts, it would be appreciated.