@honestauntyelle said in Confirmation / Warning when lowering Emissary before Selling Hourglass:

@goldsmen I'm not sure how it would drive people nuts?

My suggestion is that the confirmation prompt would only show, if you had unused hourglass value.

How often do you intentionally drop Emissary before selling hourglass value?

I have never dropped emissary before cashing in the glass so far, but with hold to activate as its own confirmation, i think having to hold then having to also confirm ontop of that would be a hassle. If there was no hold to interact then i would be fine with confirmations.

@goldsmen I'm not sure how it would drive people nuts?

My suggestion is that the confirmation prompt would only show, if you had unused hourglass value.

How often do you intentionally drop Emissary before selling hourglass value?

@MaximusArael020 If it only shows when necessary, and not always, people wouldn't get in the pattern of skipping it.

@honestauntyelle Im sorry to hear that your parents were like that, i do understand.

As for proximity, i do think its still fine seeing as the table was altered, it just takes time to retrain muscle memory, might i suggest when you go up to the tables, lock your eyes on the bright glowing one on the table the moment you enter the tavern or see the reaper stand? Any time i enter the tavern i always notice that the hour glass one is glowing from across the room even when im not doing it, and it just draws my attention, so maby locking onto that can help some.

I would be willing to vouch for a confirmation for some actions with specific accessibility settings on as well, but not on by default, it would drive me nuts among many people who already use default hold to activate.

If this is to be added then it would need to be an option added to the settings to turn it on and off because there is a mixed amount of people on this as some would like to see this addition added however others don't. I can see why people would like this added however for those who don't it is a hindrance.

I mean, sure? I'm all for anything that helps with accessibility.

One thing that will probably end up happening, though, is that people will get so used to just skipping past the prompt that in times when it matters they will quickly skip the "are you sure" prompt and hit the button anyway, because, like OP said, habits are hard to break. But if it ends up helping some people in the long-run, that's all that really matters.

@goldsmen

@goldsmen said in Confirmation / Warning when lowering Emissary before Selling Hourglass:

That said, if having accessibility enabled is causing these issues, it seems its not an issue with proximity, so much as how the settings in question work.

It's not an issue with the accessibility settings, 'holding' can be cancelled by targeting something else, or walking away.

For me, this is how I see it.

Lowering Hourglass, and Lowering Emissary are very close together, on a related table, that previously had only 1 function.

This relates the 2 interactables closely in my mind.

Approaching the table, basically enacts 'muscle memory' that I want to look to the right, due to the amount of hours played, and when tired or in a rush, careless mistakes are made that could be prevented.

So it's absolutely an issue with proximity. If you lowered hourglass on the ship, (whilst it would make less sense in the world since you MUST be at an outpost to lower, having lower hour glass be closely related to, the actual hourglass, and where you RAISE it) I'd believe I'd never run into this issue.

But the game designers saw fit, to make it 'more convenient' to cash in the hourglass, after flags, by placing it all at the check-out area, as well as making it 'make more sense' in the world of why you must be at an outpost to lower.

@crowedhunter said in Confirmation / Warning when lowering Emissary before Selling Hourglass:

Related: I've lost 5 emissary bounties to doing things in the wrong order. But I don't really think that's as bad as the hourglass one.

Yeah, so the logic IMO should be.

1. If you have unsold flags, that can be sold at the current location, warn about lowering hourglass. otherwise allow lowering immediately.
2. If you have unsold HourGlass Value, or Unclaimed Emissary Missions, warn before lowering emissary, otherwise allow lowering immediately.

The only person that should be warned IMO, is the final (maybe first?) person to vote, that would cause the effect to occur immediately, so no more people then necessary are annoyed.

Unsold flags could be a problem, as it may be difficult to track if they are no longer on deck, or in pirates hands...

@goldsmen said in Confirmation / Warning when lowering Emissary before Selling Hourglass:

Edit: There has been no gate keeping, im not sure how pointing out that people are using something intended for accessibility as a convenience could be construed as such, but i never said you have no right to anything, nor acted in any such way. Debate is not gate keeping.

Apologies then, I'm used to having to deal with my parents, who perceive any sort of accessibility options as weakness, even if you are accessing them liberally / early, I'm probably projecting slightly, Dad refused glasses for so long, and Mum refuses to even try hearing aids.

@honestauntyelle said in Confirmation / Warning when lowering Emissary before Selling Hourglass:

@goldsmen said in Confirmation / Warning when lowering Emissary before Selling Hourglass:

@honestauntyelle If you have an actual accessibility issue, thats one thing, but a lot of people watched 1 video about "settings you can change for better gameplay" and turned on that accessibility feature just because they thought pressing a button once is just more convenient, then they have issue with it down the line and complain instead of turning it off.

It can be easy to not realize what you are doing until you have done it, but never have i ever accidentally done a push to hold by mistake, its always things that are quick to do, like accidentally loading my blunder bombs into my cannon ball barrel, instead of taking out something else.

I have "actual" accessibility issues, as do a LOT of the people who enabled it after watching those videos.

Physical:
Ship Bobbing / Row boat Bobbing / Sea Bobbing / clustered items makes it difficult for me to pick up items.

Mental:
Forgetfulness of daily routines.
Once I get in the habit of doing something lowering emissary at the emissary table, when I go to the emissary table, it's extremely hard to break said pattern.

I'm now up to 4 times where I've done this by accident, and that's just the ones I've been tracking over this weekend, and it's entirely unrelated to the hold to interact, as I don't realize until it lowers.

---

Accessibility options in games, makes games available and more enjoyable to a wider audience period, and I don't appreciate the gate keeping on the matter.

I never said you dont have accessibility issues. I was simply stating many people who dont, tend to use it for convenience.

That said, if having accessibility enabled is causing these issues, it seems its not an issue with proximity, so much as how the settings in question work.

Edit: There has been no gate keeping, im not sure how pointing out that people are using something intended for accessibility as a convenience could be construed as such, but i never said you have no right to anything, nor acted in any such way. Debate is not gate keeping.

@goldsmen said in Confirmation / Warning when lowering Emissary before Selling Hourglass:

@honestauntyelle If you have an actual accessibility issue, thats one thing, but a lot of people watched 1 video about "settings you can change for better gameplay" and turned on that accessibility feature just because they thought pressing a button once is just more convenient, then they have issue with it down the line and complain instead of turning it off.

It can be easy to not realize what you are doing until you have done it, but never have i ever accidentally done a push to hold by mistake, its always things that are quick to do, like accidentally loading my blunder bombs into my cannon ball barrel, instead of taking out something else.

I have "actual" accessibility issues, as do a LOT of the people who enabled it after watching those videos.

Physical:
Ship Bobbing / Row boat Bobbing / Sea Bobbing / clustered items makes it difficult for me to pick up items.

Mental:
Forgetfulness of daily routines.
Once I get in the habit of doing something lowering emissary at the emissary table, when I go to the emissary table, it's extremely hard to break said pattern.

I'm now up to 4 times where I've done this by accident, and that's just the ones I've been tracking over this weekend, and it's entirely unrelated to the hold to interact, as I don't realize until it lowers.

Accessibility options in games, makes games available and more enjoyable to a wider audience period, and I don't appreciate the gate keeping on the matter.

@burnbacon You wouldn't get the are-you-sure message if you did it in the correct order, it'd just be stupid to ask people 'are they sure' if they have zero hourglass value.

The amount of times I've voted on them in the wrong order is ridiculous

First time, shame on you
Second Time, Shame on "game"
Third and further, Shame on you for not learning your mistake :p

I mean, you have to hold the button for a lot longer compare to Emissary.

it doesn't help that they are right next to each other,

and yet so far apart.

Can we please add a confirmation when you lower an Emissary

Im in a rush, I dont need a "Are you sure?" message appearing when Im trying to get it done and over with

@honestauntyelle If you have an actual accessibility issue, thats one thing, but a lot of people watched 1 video about "settings you can change for better gameplay" and turned on that accessibility feature just because they thought pressing a button once is just more convenient, then they have issue with it down the line and complain instead of turning it off.

It can be easy to not realize what you are doing until you have done it, but never have i ever accidentally done a push to hold by mistake, its always things that are quick to do, like accidentally loading my blunder bombs into my cannon ball barrel, instead of taking out something else.

@jasonk36o I was selling flags by default first, and still had no idea they were worth Allegiance. When they decide to count is so random, I'm forced to wonder whether the flags actually give Alle. or if it's just commendation progress popping.

@honestauntyelle said in Confirmation / Warning when lowering Emissary before Selling Hourglass:

Can we please add a confirmation when you lower an Emissary, when you still have Hourglass Value?

The amount of times I've voted on them in the wrong order is ridiculous, costing me my bonus every time, it doesn't help that they are right next to each other, I think it would help forgetful old players, and new players alike.

Agreed. We also did this many times in the beginning because we weren't sure how one affected the other and also lost out on much gold and allegiance. I've also lowered my Hourglass when I still had emmy flags to sell, thinking that the flags increased the Faction Loot on board to give me more allegiance when I downvoted Hourglass. But no, I lost a lot of allegiance by not selling the flag when I had Hourglass value. Now I know the order is sell flags, Hourglass, Emmissary. Only took several months to figure that out.
:(

Sure

people are often tired, frustrated, burnt out, or focused on other things at the end of a session, especially in HG

Everything in QoL is "a person could/should do this" QoL is about improving the experience or design for people

if it doesn't harm others or interfere in risk/reward or combat then there isn't much to oppose imo

I don't see why you are getting push back for an QoL feature.

But we really don't have this anywhere in the game for interactable so I doubt they'd do it.

Just watch where you are holding X I suppose.

@capt-pilotes said in Confirmation / Warning when lowering Emissary before Selling Hourglass:

This is a mechanic you learn by failing when you don't pay attention. It happened only once with one partner and since then I'm more cautious when selling Hourglass value.

For newer players, even once is too many. It's a large reduction of gold and rep.

@goldsmen People with accessibility issues, shocker, also tend to have accessibility issues, meaning that it's hard to correctly position between 2 prompts very close together, or even tell them apart at a glance.

Currently the only way to cancel the hold-to-cancel animation afaik is to back away or change focus.

That said, that's not what is happening here, often you only realize a mistake after the action is taken.

This is a mechanic you learn by failing when you don't pay attention. It happened only once with one partner and since then I'm more cautious when selling Hourglass value.

@d3adst1ck said in Confirmation / Warning when lowering Emissary before Selling Hourglass:

@goldsmen said in Confirmation / Warning when lowering Emissary before Selling Hourglass:

My advice is dont just press buttons in reaction, they still have a hold to activate mechanic which means you cant accidentally just press a button once, on the one you didnt mean to press. Hold to activate is the confirmation.

Unless you have an accessibility setting on of course. Seems odd that making the game more accessible would also make it more prone to errors.

I have noticed that a lot of people that use that setting use it for convenience rather than accessibility, then complain about the results of their choice.

@honestauntyelle don’t rush dropping the emmi flag before the HG then. This isn’t on Rare cause you make a mistake. Skill issue.

@goldsmen said in Confirmation / Warning when lowering Emissary before Selling Hourglass:

My advice is dont just press buttons in reaction, they still have a hold to activate mechanic which means you cant accidentally just press a button once, on the one you didnt mean to press. Hold to activate is the confirmation.

Unless you have an accessibility setting on of course. Seems odd that making the game more accessible would also make it more prone to errors.

My advice is dont just press buttons in reaction, they still have a hold to activate mechanic which means you cant accidentally just press a button once, on the one you didnt mean to press. Hold to activate is the confirmation.

@honestauntyelle said in Confirmation / Warning when lowering Emissary before Selling Hourglass:

Can we please add a confirmation when you lower an Emissary, when you still have Hourglass Value?

The amount of times I've voted on them in the wrong order is ridiculous, costing me my bonus every time, it doesn't help that they are right next to each other, I think it would help forgetful old players, and new players alike.

Almost did this earlier.