Yes, I’m coming off a particularly miserable experience of following a Red Sea Reaper 5 brig.
Bias as I may be, this could be a pretty wonderful way of alleviating some spiteful misery inducing plays. And make for interesting encounters at the salty finish line.
Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water
Even if it just reduces the ship speed by 50 percent. From my experience Red Seas plays have become so prolific, that we could at least look at making the end of them more sporting and interesting.
Or we can keep walking away with both parties pretending they won somehow…
Cheers guys.
Would love some constructive feedback.
as long as people can hop servers all day spending a short amount of time with no loot investment to go sink easy to find loaded reaper ships the other side should be able to do what they want
neither side should be nerfed or tinkered with
they have no obligations as reapers it's just that simple. People might get annoyed and frustrated but they simply can do whatever they want just like the people chasing after them
@pithyrumble said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
Going to make my usual suggestion. Significantly increase Red Sea damage. Move despawn wall further out. You can still get my loot at great personal risk. Slowing down all parties would just draw it out longer.
It's an established thing so any altering of it is interference to pick one side over another
it's kinda lame to run a buncha loot into the red sea and it's also kinda lame to stack a ship full of skilled pvpers and contribute very little if anything to a server while popping loaded ships in 15 minutes over and over.
neither are wrong and both aren't doing what's best for the server. No reason to pick one over the other with changes.
The reapers waste more time and all their profits by red seaing loot. Chasing pvpers lose time but typically much less time and much less loot. Their ego battles are theirs to figure out
@pithyrumble I like that a lot. This is the “sporting” chance I’m talking about.
It’s just boring atm.@wolfmanbush a change to Red Sea still affects both parties. And still creates risks.
Consider that Rare created a naval battle system that doesn’t exist anywhere else. And people are choosing to not partake in manner which yes is their right (I get it! Point taken.) but I honestly don’t think it makes anyone particularly happy. Both sides walk away feeling kinda gross.
If I was Rare and I saw an opportunity to at least make it more interesting and sporting. I would take it.
Thus this suggestion.
I think it has merit. And would honestly create a more entertaining experience.Consider this:
Both ships taking risks. Gathering that loot will not be easy. And the runners (even after they sink) have a chance of boarding and making their pursuer sink to the slow and dangerous waters.This just sounds way more fun that blinking out of existence, doesn’t it?
@mostexpendable said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
@wolfmanbush a change to Red Sea still affects both parties. And still creates risks.
Consider that Rare created a naval battle system that doesn’t exist anywhere else. And people are choosing to not partake in manner which yes is their right (I get it! Point taken.) but I honestly don’t think it makes anyone particularly happy. Both sides walk away feeling kinda gross.
If I was Rare and I saw an opportunity to at least make it more interesting and sporting. I would take it.
Thus this suggestion.
I think it has merit. And would honestly create a more entertaining experience.Consider this:
Both ships taking risks. Gathering that loot will not be easy. And the runners (even after they sink) have a chance of boarding and making their pursuer sink to the slow and dangerous waters.This just sounds way more fun that blinking out of existence, doesn’t it?
they gave pvpers chain shots and supplies that can be purchased which are ridiculous advantages already for the types of players generally chasing ships and specifically reapers
They've made it far too easy the way it is.
@wolfmanbush this debate doesn’t have to be about PVP biases man.
A reaper attacked us last night. We got sunk. More power to them. A hefty supply of flags were taken from us. Fair enough. They sold some loot at plunder. We caught up to them before they got to reapers. And rather than try to sell anything or engage, at all.
They went to the Red Sea. They sent taunting messages. That’s a troll. Not some poor PVE player.
All fair.
But I’m suggesting that we make it less of a mute point. And introduce drama and the possibility or a fun gameplay loop back into the equation.
I refuse to believe Rare, a game developer would prefer this outcome, to a potentially nail biting finish.
There’s potential to improve the gameplay experience without being an imposition on ones human rights.
So that’s the discussion I’m aiming to put forward.Simple red sea fixes.
Sailing into the red sea should be slow to allow chasing ships to catch up. The further out you get the slower you go.
Sailing out of the red sea should be fast so that if you get boarded and sailed to the red sea you can sail out as soon as possible.
Loot dropped should drift equally as fast to the edge of the sea and the respawn time only starts once there.
There should be birds for loot everywhere, not just red sea.
1 to 5 bits small group, 6 to 20 medium, 21+ large.No I don't think it should slow them down. Kraken water slows ship down cuz it's filled with large amount of ink.
However, if a ship sinks in the Red Sea, there should definitely be a punishment. All chests that are outside the border of the map should swim back to main waters. Everything in the sea of thieves, STAYS in the sea of thieves, such is the way of the devil's shroud!
If a crew portal hops to avoid a fight, their loot is able to be collected. Why should the red sea be any different? Make the loot spawn in an area where it can be collected...make it IN the red sea, but not past the despawn wall. It would make it challenging to collect the loot, especially if you're on a solo sloop, but not impossible.
@miserenz said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
Simple red sea fixes.
Sailing into the red sea should be slow to allow chasing ships to catch up. The further out you get the slower you go.
Sailing out of the red sea should be fast so that if you get boarded and sailed to the red sea you can sail out as soon as possible.
Loot dropped should drift equally as fast to the edge of the sea and the respawn time only starts once there.
There should be birds for loot everywhere, not just red sea.
1 to 5 bits small group, 6 to 20 medium, 21+ large.Of course these changes would be ideal. Yes please.
But I’m trying to find a compromise for those players who believe spitefully dumping their loot into oblivion is their god given right. Sure I won’t even argue.
What I want is to slow them down, like 50%, and allow pursuers a chance to catch up. It might at least introduce some suspense to the situation.
@sweetsandman said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
If a crew portal hops to avoid a fight, their loot is able to be collected. Why should the red sea be any different? Make the loot spawn in an area where it can be collected...make it IN the red sea, but not past the despawn wall. It would make it challenging to collect the loot, especially if you're on a solo sloop, but not impossible.
there is a massive difference between sacrificing everything and jumping servers with a level 5 flag and all your supplies
In my experience, Red Sea plays aren't that common. But when they happen they're super annoying.
It's not a pressing issue for me and I prefer if the development team worked on mechanics that encouraged both to fight or negotiate to lower the risk / reward instead of having this option in the first place.
That being said, your idea is a good one.
@wolfmanbush said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
there is a massive difference between sacrificing everything and jumping servers with a level 5 flag and all your supplies
Keeping your flag through a portal is a whole different discussion I'll leave out of this thread.
With regard to the topic at hand, whether you're hopping through a portal or sailing into the red sea, you're forfeiting your loot. Why should one render your loot lost to Davey Jones and the other allow another crew to collect it safely?
@sweetsandman said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
@wolfmanbush said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
there is a massive difference between sacrificing everything and jumping servers with a level 5 flag and all your supplies
Keeping your flag through a portal is a whole different discussion I'll leave out of this thread.
With regard to the topic at hand, whether you're hopping through a portal or sailing into the red sea, you're forfeiting your loot. Why should one render your loot lost to Davey Jones and the other allow another crew to collect it safely?
one is an established option and strategy and as I said which is very relevant one is a complete sacrifice and the other is a strategical sacrifice
I'm not in the business of defending all the tinkering and inconsistencies that have been popping up more and more on the game but the red sea one being messed with is entirely picking aggressors that failed over runners that succeed.
Devs should not be picking winners and losers after something has been established and adapted to/with
The loot isn't an entitlement. It's earned not awarded
@wolfmanbush said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
but the red sea one being messed with is entirely picking aggressors that failed over runners that succeed.
You're assuming that the chaser is always the aggressor. That's not always the case, especially when it comes to fort keys. Also, it's not that they necessarily failed, it's that in some cases, they were never given a chance to succeed since there is such a large gap in the speed of each ship, specifically as it pertains to the sloop. A brig can accidentally outrun a sloop without managing their sails in any way, and so can a galleon.
Let me be clear. I don't want red sea'd loot to drop in the regular part of the sea. I want it to drop deep in the red sea. Recoverable, but at the risk of sinking yourself. Especially if the crew that went into the red sea is feeling a little cheeky, hops off and sticks around to really make it challenging for the other crew to recover it.
If I understood Well, people with loot goes to Red Sea with the idea of avoid the crew Who is chasing them trying to steal their loot, right? Or dying there to don't let the others pick the loot?
What is the problem? Keep allways the Tall Tale 9 checkpoint on your saved games and problem fixed. It let you sail that sea, right?
Pvp lovers have 2 checkpoints on the book, The Shores of gold and the One that opens a portal to jump between servers Looking for noobies to ruin their day, or running away when they face skilled players that can easy sink them as they do with new players :).
My brig crew and I were running as a Reaper emmisary yesterday and spotted another brig at an island. Upon approach, we were spotted and they made a run for the Red. Once we realized this, we slowed our approach and mirrored their movements to blockade their way back. They realized that we weren't going to pursue them, so they attempted to make a break for it back into the Sea. They failed in that attempt.
You need to be able to read your opponent's actions sometimes before they even happen, and perform countermoves to manipulate them into doing what you want. It's basically a game of cat and mouse. So, which are you?
Hi together,
I have read trough this whole threat.
There are people which like to engage in PvP who are consend in there opinion, that the red sea in this state is bad.
Every proposal here aims at forcing PvP more.
-slower speed will only help in the case that you can harpun the other ship.
-loot should swim into the map boarders can only discourage red sea runners, because running is pointless
-othersWhich leads to: i am entiteld to your loot, because i follow you and you dont want to PvP.
I for my part, dont see a solution here which is better. If i want to grief the loot which is on my ship, i find other ways.
Red Sea can stay as it is i think.
@wolfmanbush said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
I'm not in the business of defending all the tinkering and inconsistencies that have been popping up more and more on the game but the red sea one being messed with is entirely picking aggressors that failed over runners that succeed.
It sounds to me like your definition of success is different for the runner vs the aggressor.
Why do you consider it a failure if the aggressor does not retrieve or hand in loot, but a success for the runner if the loot isn't handed in either, and on top of that, they sink?
@touchiertooth28 said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
@wolfmanbush said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
I'm not in the business of defending all the tinkering and inconsistencies that have been popping up more and more on the game but the red sea one being messed with is entirely picking aggressors that failed over runners that succeed.
It sounds to me like your definition of success is different for the runner vs the aggressor.
Why do you consider it a failure if the aggressor does not retrieve or hand in loot, but a success for the runner if the loot isn't handed in either, and on top of that, they sink?
It's an ego battle for both.
Chaser most of the time is not just going for loot they are going for the sink/kills otherwise they could just go get loot elsewhere. They wanna pound their chest. A runner that doesn't allow this has "won" the ego battle. Which is why these red sea threads are as common as stuff from the pve side of things
Doesn't always start out that way but the frustrations of chasing and running quickly and commonly amplify the desire to punish the other side in one way or another.
To someone with a view like mine they both lose but ego battles are funny business
@wsurftvveeds said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
I think some kind of "slow down" before the absolute despawn point (but not right at the boundary to the red sea) would be good. Ignoring the PvP vs PvE debate, it would just help keep immersion.
Doing so would remove the strategy of anchor dropping or leading pursuers to the red sea. If done right, the pursuers may sink, but one wrong input and you might be the one to sink. Furthermore, waht reasoning would there be for the red sea slowing ships down? These are things to consider and are great counter arguments to the OP
If anything that would improve the strategy, as you could now anchor drop to trap the pursuers in the slowed area, then cannon them. Then pick up any loot they might drop.
It's more logical for the red sea to slow ships down than it is for them to magically disappear completely and make their loot despawn is it not? I'm not talking about a slow right on the boundary, just a slow before you reach the absolute despawn point.
Heck the sea changes colour completely, I think a small slow is nothing lore-wise lol.
@wsurftvveeds said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
If anything that would improve the strategy, as you could now anchor drop to trap the pursuers in the slowed area, then cannon them. Then pick up any loot they might drop.
It's more logical for the red sea to slow ships down than it is for them to magically disappear completely and make their loot despawn is it not? I'm not talking about a slow right on the boundary, just a slow before you reach the absolute despawn point.
Heck the sea changes colour completely, I think a small slow is nothing lore-wise lol.
Disappear? No as it is is alright, it destroys the ships. That's why you find so many ships shipwrecked in the shroud in the maiden voyage. There's lots of problems with slowing down on the edge of the map. First off, no it wouldn't help with the strategy, as slowing down a ship would just allow it to turn faster, enemies can still focus fire on you, especially when you try to turn away and they start to slow down which precisely allows them to focus fire and hammer on your backside as you try to turn away and escape. Furthermore, slowing down makes no sense at the edge of the map, as it wouldn't stop ships from continuing to move onwards untill... well nothing since they'd still be able to sail, albeit slower, on and on.
If you could find a work around for these counterpoints and an explanation that goes with the lore of the game I might consider it. My stance for the moment is to keep it as is except that all treasure gets pulled back to the game world.
@red0demon0 so you're saying that when you get in a fight with someone being krakened is an advantage because it lets you turn quicker? (which is incorrect, tighter is perhaps a better word for it)
They would still be taking damage while slowed lol. It just makes sure ships sink before they can reach the absolute despawn point. (destroying =/= vanishing btw).
@wsurftvveeds said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
@red0demon0 so you're saying that when you get in a fight with someone being krakened is an advantage because it lets you turn quicker?
They would still be taking damage while slowed lol. It just makes sure ships sink before they can reach the absolute despawn point. (destroying =/= vanishing btw).
Ah i see, I was not aware they would still take damage. If there was no kraken, yes, ships would be better able to attack, but with taking damage it might work. You can't compare the two in this circumstance though because kraken does more than just slow down and hurt the ship, it effectively forces the attacked crew to use most resources on attacking the beast as the crew becomes susceptible to all attacks. The kraken itself has the ability to disable players, put the ship to a complete stop without being able to move or turn, and attack the ship itself, which makes the crews susceptible to attacks from outside forces.
However, that still leaves the fact that lore wise it doesn't make sense why a red sea would slow down ships.
@drizkillz I mean the whole point of the Shroudbreaker would nullify that slowness, and at least the shroud breaker is somewhat a strat whereas the red sea running is just being a loser
@gallerine5582 said in Red Sea slows ships down like Kraken water:
@drizkillz I mean the whole point of the Shroudbreaker would nullify that slowness, and at least the shroud breaker is somewhat a strat whereas the red sea running is just being a loser
No need for names, people are free to play however they want, they don't have to play the way you want them to. Heck, if you have enough money and don't need the loot, it's not only fun, but funny too.
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