I think it was foolish to announce this before the weapon rebalancing and double-gun fix was released. Furthermore, they should have waited until after keyboard/mouse support was enabled for Xbox. Those changes will likely be huge improvements for crossplay fairness. If they'd simply done that and stayed silent on the idea of "optional" crossplay, I bet the community would have been tickled pink. Instead, it's civil war on the forums. Ugh.
[Mega Thread] Crossplay announcement in the recent Dev Update video.
@dotcomrobots ALL of SoT is competitively focused, all of it as any point you can be attacked/go attack for the sake of it or to steal look. Arena mode focusing on the attacking side only doesnt change the fact that Adventure mode is exactly the same just with PvE in there....so the option to opt out has to be for everything or there is no point at all to it.
Also, not every player is going to gravitate to the Arena, there are those in the original game now to be Adventure, that wanted this opt out option before any shift to a PVP only mode was considered.
@cokney-charmer So basically because you are an Xbox player, and these issues wouldn't affect you, it doesn't matter? I wouldn't say that helps further discussion on the topic or help build the community.
As far as taking "stuff" on the forums goes, whatever that means, I don't see that as justifying optional cross-play either. Being attacked is never okay but that doesn't mean it's alright to slice off a portion of the community either. I would put that under generalizing which isn't something anyone should be doing.
@genuine-heather I have seen your previous posts on this matter, and you among others have focused on the "gameplay reasons" only behind this change.
All games with PvP aspects need to be constantly worked on to remain balanced and heading into year 2 of SoT, we are about to get the biggest change yet for weapons and combat partly down to the double gun exploit favoured by PC players and some Xbox players, but with PvP becoming the new meta for the game it had to be addressed.
It would still have to be addressed even if opting out of Crossplay was there from the start, so just because it is announced now doesnt change or mean it has to wait for balance changes.
The moment i learned they would implement the option for xbox only i quit the game. It has no point playing it anymore, the servers are empty as it is without this divide of players. The difference in amount of players on xbox and pc is huge..
You should have told this from the start, i got jebaited@Cokney-Charmer Getting attacked anytime and anywhere isn't "competitive"
Competitive is when you are competing against someone else, by points, kills, sunk ships, treasure collected etc... all of these are achieving a goal and following a rule for a game mode.
None of these conditions are obligatory in the Adventure mode, you simply sail, help new players, help a crew without having a scoreboard or any objective at all.
So no, Adventure mode isn't competitve and being sunk or stolen doesn't make it either.
@dennis-box a dit dans [Mega Thread] Crossplay announcement in the recent Dev Update video. :
Can we also divide the playerbase regarding high end/low end pc, what mouse and keyboard they are using, if they are using a controller and pls divide by the controller they are using. Also we have to divide by internet speed so we have a level playing field.
This guy nailed it.
Hard to tell a joke in text. Also far too many people when called out claim it's a joke. But, let's go with that for now.
@navillicious For ten months when the issues were affecting me, noone on the PC side was bothered....didn't affect them if me or my crew played this game or if it made it not fun for us. So now all of a sudden there is a fear the game wont be as fun for them and its an issue for them, I should be expected to still not enjoy the game so they can?
I only say that because I genuinely believe it wont have the impact on them as they fear, that if more effort was put into by the very people, top streamers, all being sheep and suddenly playing this game after almost a year, were to focus on encouraging their own PC player fanbase to play this game it would do a lot more good then continuing the alienation of many Xbox players who are avoiding SoT because of Crossplay and other problems they have.
@navillicious said in [Mega Thread] Crossplay announcement in the recent Dev Update video.:
@pomalotacusmk3 It's still divisive, also a controller still costs more than a KB&M, I'm all for KB&M support on Xbox but if you're looking for the "cheapest" option it would not be "buy a controller". I could also assume most people already have a computer with a KB&M?
I want a single server pool with the choice between both options. As soon as this support is added what would be the reason to have separate pools? At that point it's entirely the player's decision on how they want to play. If they choose to play with a controller, alright, controllers can still hold their own against a KB&M it's not like anyone on a KB&M is a god at the game automatically.
14 controllers are cheaper than 86 keyboards and 86 mice. It looks like rare are going with separate pools. I think pressuring them for kbm and controller pools instead of pc and xbox pools is more productive than trying to stop the separation altogether.
Also important to note is that rare can separate us NOW, which will remove the advantage NOW. You are telling the majority too bad, you're stuck with us, and the advantage will continue untill some unspecified future date when xbox gets kbm, maybe 2019, maybe 2020, who cares.
@dotcomrobots if you are trying to kill me, sink my ship, take my stuff...that is competitive play my friend, anything that can or does put Player against Player is competitive gaming. It also does not have to be obligatory either, but its there and is always a part of this game because just like in the WWE, you can be hit by an RKO outta nowhere!
Points, a scoreboard, leaderboard or league table simply recording the results isnt the only way to define what is competitive.
Hope that clears it up.
@cokney-charmer If anything, Xbox players aren't alienated, they make up the large majority of the community. Now we have tools coming out that will allow you to "level the playing field" and hook up your own M&KB, but it seems nobody wants to do that, use the thing they swear gives a huge advantage, so what are the complaints about a fair playing field?
I think people are underestimating just how many Xbox players will be turning off cross-play, and GoW4 is a good example to look at for this, but darn those pc players and their advantages!
@pomalotacusmk3 If we are talking about collective funds, sure? That's not really the right way to think about it though? You would just need one M&KB per person which would come out of said one person's wallet. Rare made the KB&M support announcement in the same dev video, so I would imagine that support couldn't be too far off. Speculating there but, still, I would rather not divide the community but oh well.
@cokney-charmer this guy is right.
The issue been pc lags and reduces console mechanics is THE issue. Groups have silently tested and produced reports and firm evidence of this. This is why you see the option, because at this point they have been unable to resolve it, weather it be a bug in the engine or a net code problem ( who knows but those who did the testing ) and a big shout out to all those involved you know who you are!
Obviously once it’s resolved console players will then be able to once again, enjoy playing with their pc friends again without server and machanic disruption.@navillicious I think you are also overestimating how many Xbox console players will suddenly decide to go out or to plug in a K&M just to play this game to level the playing field as well.
For example, I work in IT, I have a PC and laptop I use up to ten hours a day for my job. When I come home I do not want to then sit at another desk infront of another PC with M&K to play video games to relax as a hobby with my friends. That is why I main console gaming on PS4 and Xbox One.
Publishers may want to make Crossplay a thing, and without any imbalance or disadvantage from one side to the other it can work, but until it is 100% there, console players have the right to expect to be given the option not to take part in Crossplay gaming just as PC players should have the option not to with Console gamers.
It is fair for an option to opt out to be included by default in such games imo, and I respect that you may disagree.
@navillicious said in [Mega Thread] Crossplay announcement in the recent Dev Update video.:
The game is as competitive as the other ships choose to make it. You have no control over them. If you want to run or scuttle, you lose the competition.
That's what I was responding to
Oh, ok.
It was being suggested that kbm advantage doesn't matter because the game isnt competitive. I was explaining that sot is competitive. A crew has no control over the other boats in the server. The level of compeitiveness is dictated by the other crews. If you arent playing competitive, but crews are trying to sink you, you either play competitive or lose. The announcement by rare means that all my combat will be decided by skill, not equipment advantage. Try re reading those posts and see if it makes sense now.@genuine-heather said in [Mega Thread] Crossplay announcement in the recent Dev Update video.:
It's amazing how much some people can talk without actually saying anything.
it also amazing how so much can be explained and yet some people are unable to listen and learn and appreciate different opinions.
Its a funny old world here on in the interweb eh
@Cokney-Charmer You're wrong.
Adventure mode has no competitive objectives, you're not competiting against a set of players that have the same goals than yours and thus to WIN a game. Some do cargo, some do Forts, some others do GH.. it all depends.
Also note how all players aren't reacting the same way. Some are agressive, some are very passive, others are really into alliances and friendships...
Does that sound like a competitive mode here?
Not really... but of course when a fight is engaged, yes there will be a challenge into sinking the opponnent ships and steal his loot, but that's concerning a very precise situation where a fight is engaged... but does that mean that the whole server is also concerned by this ? Will that change the amount of gold the other players will win ? No. They're doing something totally different a few kms away from you and don't even know what's happenning on your side. Their goals won't be affected by whether you'll lose or not.
You have to distinguish what a competitive server is, and what a competitive gameplay is.
Arena is a comptitive server/game mode with gameplay mechanics that oppose players against each other. That's what I call competitive.
Adventure mode is an open world campaign where players can sail together or not, peacefully or not and craft their own adventures. That is not competitive only because fights, which are optional I repeat and entierly dependent on people's way of playing, can make you loose your loot.
Not that hard to understand mate ;)
@dotcomrobots Ok lets take your example of the game itself and take the Meglodon. There are different types who all behave differently but you never know until they make their intentions clear.
But when you see one, you prepare for the worst....same with other crews and ships. Even in an alliance the risk of betrayal is always there. Only way to not make SoT competitive at all is have Friendly Fire on at all times, so you and your ship cant take any damage from any other player or player ship.
So, whilst SoT is not an eSport in the sense of competitive nature, the very backbone to SoT is that it can always, always be PvP which makes it competitive at all times because at any time it can be.
Hopefully that was easier to understand mate :)
@navillicious This issue became a major debate rather then a focus on what it is and how to fix it, the community was divided on the topic. The people who tested it are software engineers/developers themselves and when questioned about this they grouped together to test all 3 Xbox platforms against pc in different states in Australia and some overseas as well. It was found not to be settings/internet etc but something in the game its self. The results were passed onto the devs with overwhelming evidence in a good faith ( hey guys we found this ) and only a few days later it was announced. Tipping I could stand on some toes here I will not be sharing documents or videos etc on the forums or with anyone not required to view them.
@lethality1 said in [Mega Thread] Crossplay announcement in the recent Dev Update video.:
@navillicious said in [Mega Thread] Crossplay announcement in the recent Dev Update video.:
@danielg360 No pc users will only ever play in crossplay servers.
If this is really about input device balance, then they should make sure PC players on controllers have the opt-out option too. Heck, Rare themselves use controllers on a PC every week on stream!
Thats what quite a few xboxers have been asking for, input based NOT platform based. Maybe rare have been struggling to limit pc players to a controller type? Too many loopholes maybe? But i thought fortnite solved this, i dont think you can change control scheme mid game in fortnite?
@Cokney-Charmer Well yeah that's why you need to distinguish competitive gameplay and competitive game mode.
Adventure isn't a competitive game mode because you have an endless journey with a lot of possiblites even if you may have to at some point engage in fights which are challenging. But that's not the point in Adventure... it's not to sink ships, or make friends exclusively. You have the choice and you're not exclusively competiting against someone.
Arena on the other hand is a mode which is competitive focused, meaning that you are competing against other poeple and that you are ALL playing in a "time framed" environement meaning that it has an END that will depend on a WINNER. All players are competiting for the same goals and must at then end ... win.
The difference is clear.
@pomalotacusmk3 while this is a secondary issue the controller against mouse is only a slight advantage. There is very minimal difference between all three consoles but the higher you go the better your gameplay. However it doesn’t resolve how pc’s affect the server and game mechanics of console players. This is the reason for announcement. This is also the reason pc doesn’t have the option.
@dotcomrobots the only difference here is how you and I view what being competitive is, which is fine and all good for a good discussion.
Arena being PvP focused does not remove the PvP from Adventure mode, and Adventure mode has PvP in it all the time which is why I personally view all of SoT as competitive, because it is me against everyone and everything in the world at the time I play, it can lead to a fight with another player, it may not but the world is still competitive.
Appreciate we may not agree but it has been a good talk all the same, enjoy the rest of your Sunday my friend.
PC player here.
I'm new to the game and can tell you if any Xbox players come for me, I will be a sitting duck. Anyway...I do not agree with removing X-Platform, I understand it is an option and till it is implemented we can only speculate how much of an impact it will have but I feel it will have a negative impact on PC players.
It has been stated that the PC playerbase is not nearly equal to the Xbox player base, so unlinking the two playerbases will make it harder to have full games and if the game feels empty of players then people will just stop playing. Or if for PC it because the same few people in one or two servers then it will make the game stale and if anything those players are more then lickly going to turn on one another till things get toxic and they just leave.
This game needs a good player count, it needs alot of things. But cutting the player count more then in half is not a good move.And I know the argument is there. "It's optional" but lets be honest, when Xbox Live created "Party Chat" how many people stopped using in game voip? How many people would log onto a match and mute everyone? "Party Chat" killed ingame Voip by making a wall between players. This is another wall.
On a side note, I used to play Titanfall 2 on PC with a controller against M/K players and I was rather good at it, when I switched to M/K, I was horrid. It's all down to player skill.
At the end of the day. "We are one Community" but this change will make a very clear split between Xbox and PC.
Ways to fix the disadvantage of controllers is to work on the game mechanics, splitting the player base is not a fix, its avoiding the problem.
Some options would be.
-Remove double gun (Or give controllers to switch weapons quickly)
-Aim assist on controllers(Maybe only vs players)
-Target locking(Not sure how well that would go but its just an idea)Another note, this game has just had a boost in players due to a number of streamers showcasing the game, this was noted and SoT even had a 50% weekend to capitalize on this renewed interest. However this move is set to divide those numbers, give a poor message to the new players (myself included) about how the game is being handled and its direction and overall turn off those new players that have just jumped in.
Speaking of new players, when the game was released it was noted as being crossplatform, it always has. Meaning all players knew they would be matched with PC players and knew of any advantages or disadvantages they would have over each other. It was a risk known going in and that is on the buyer. I know the risk of mosquitoes in foreign lands, so when I choose to visit and catch malaria I cant complain.
Anyway just my thoughts. All I know is if the PC playerbase drops to the point its hard to get a full game, the PC playerbase will just leave, we have a million other games we can play.
@Cokney-Charmer Rare is designing a new game mode that requires in depth understanding of how a competitive game works and how it would apply to SoT.
I really doubt it will just be a smaller Adventure mode, i think they are rethinking how the players will behave in close quarter PVP along with all the SoT elements and it's really a very different work than designing the Adventure mode.
Good talking with you matey ;)
@cokney-charmer said in [Mega Thread] Crossplay announcement in the recent Dev Update video.:
@navillicious For ten months when the issues were affecting me, noone on the PC side was bothered....didn't affect them if me or my crew played this game or if it made it not fun for us. So now all of a sudden there is a fear the game wont be as fun for them and its an issue for them, I should be expected to still not enjoy the game so they can?
I only say that because I genuinely believe it wont have the impact on them as they fear, that if more effort was put into by the very people, top streamers, all being sheep and suddenly playing this game after almost a year, were to focus on encouraging their own PC player fanbase to play this game it would do a lot more good then continuing the alienation of many Xbox players who are avoiding SoT because of Crossplay and other problems they have.
Can you answer me this? How does an inherently small player base of 15% affect you that much? How do you know that each time you have not enjoyed the game it was because of PC players?
It seems like a lot of hyperbole. On the other hand having less people the play with is a very real concern on already quiet servers.
@caesar-rp - not to answer for the other guy... but you know when you’re playing against a PC player because they type at you (which is something you can’t to on Xbox).
@haydnsym45 said in [Mega Thread] Crossplay announcement in the recent Dev Update video.:
@caesar-rp - not to answer for the other guy... but you know when you’re playing against a PC player because they type at you (which is something you can’t to on Xbox).
I have never typed at anyone, don't get me wrong I am sure some do. But there are also preprogramed messages that can be spammed out, are you sure you're not talking about them? How often do people "type" at you?
Maybe we need a single player mode for you, sounds like it would be great for you.
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