Sea beasts in arena? yay or nay? & crab idea

  • Should the Meg and Kracken be in arena? I say no because randomness ruins the balance of a fair fight and people can easily feel cheated. If I am having a ship battle with you and all of the sudden meg targets me I am now going to feel like I was not able to give the fight I could have and maybe it will cost me the game. Or maybe I have to spend and extra 5 minutes fighting a kracken that nobody else had to deal with. The way these creatures work now is fine in adventure, but random encounters can not work in a competitive mode.
    However I would like to make a suggestion. I have wanted a giant crab in the game for a long time. If Arena is the team to grab the most treasure or acquire the most gold this could work very well. So let's say we put a giant crab in a cave somewhere in the middle of the ocean or on an island. And let's say this crab guards treasure. Now we have a PVE/PVP element in the game. (not including snakes and sharks) This would be like Halo Warzone, you could fight the crab and maybe nobody will interfere. You could fight a team and the crab at the same time. Or maybe you wait for another team to kill the crab and you swoop in for the treasure. I think there is a lot of potential here that will work in arena much better then in adventure. Heck you could even choose to just have treasure on the crab's back like in Moana and have people try and grab it without getting killed but in this case the crab is not killable. Well I hope you all like my idea. what do you think? do you want meg and kracken in arena? how do you like my crab idea?

    EDIT: the crab would be 100% optional as a way to get gold without following the maps. Also though I think a position in the world so if people see a ship sitting in a particular spot people know they are doing the crab.

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  • But a random encounter could as easily be to your benefit as detriment.

    Poker and backgammon are definitely games of skill, despite the random element of the deal or throw of the dice. While luck may favor the less-skilled in a single game, the better player will win more in the long run.

    As long as Karen and Meg are not so frequent as to make a complete mockery of the competition, I see no harm in their being part of the fun in The Arena.

  • @anubis316

    Joe did mention this in the recent stream, it will be something they'll be looking at when testing with the Pioneers because it does need some careful thinking about -

    Arena - Meg, Kraken and other emergent elements?
    This type of content will be part of the iteration, but doesn't want it to feel unfair or match results are due to things out of your control but would be very cool to have these included. Needs to be tuned as to when, how often, strength of attack etc. Where the sole aim is competitive and to win also brings specific rewards, different emotions will be experienced to those in the main world.

    https://www.seaofthieves.com/forum/topic/75750/sea-of-thieves-weekly-stream-from-the-depths-13th-nov

  • I think they can be in there. u mention being in a ship battle and the meg targets u is kinda unfair. The meg can also target the enemy instead of u. Also unfair for them maybe but an even playing field for both of u. Sometimes u get lucky sometimes u dont.

    Also yes the meg can target u in a ship battle. But any other ship can do this aswell. Makes it 2v1. So aslong the spawnrate and strenght of the creatures isnt ridiculous i would say yes put them in.

    As for the Crab. Could be fun yes. I should not be obligated to do. Just an extra. So Arena is there to fight but u can also get extra loot if u manage to take the crab down / loot him.

  • It'll be something we all (including the development team at Rare) will have to see and figure out through testing.

    I hope that such emergent events will be in the Arena, because I think, overall, it will add to the fun. And those things will successfully deliver the unique Sea Of Thieves chaotic scenarios that can send the experiences over the top and give you lasting memories.

    I suspect the real balance may have to come through how the rewards balance out for winning vs losing. If the gap between losses and victories is too severe, then 'unfair' and unlucky emergent circumstances will make the player far more grumpy and upset.
    However, if there's a better balance between it all, so that you can lose, but still laugh it off and appreciate the fun you had during the contest... hopefully the emergent chaos can remain a part of the arena.

    Honestly, I can't imagine the Arena not having some of it. I suspect it will be more of a question as to whether these things need to be toned down (frequency and/or difficulty) and whatnot.

    As reference - in the adventure game, I know I don't mind the insanely unlucky events that may rob me of my rewards, because it was so fun to experience the craziness, and then it is funny to sit back and laugh about it all afterward.

    I could be wrong, but I suspect, for the Arena to truly be successful, it's going to need to be extremely similar to the battles and fun we've had in the main Adventure game. If it is too dissimilar, the Arena won't cut it for the players this is more targeted towards - players that just want PvP often and consistently. If that constant PvP is too removed from the amazing experience you can already find in this game, it may not be good enough.

    Just my initial thoughts on it all. :)
    We shall see!

  • @surveyorpete you don't think if you randomly get hit by meg 5 times out of 10 and lose each of those games because of it you will be mad? I think the general audience or at the very least the casual audience will rage quit the arena mode if they keep feeling like the reason they are losing is because of a random encounter

  • @weakdexx do you plan on being competitive in arena or just kinda play and have fun? maybe I just want to be super competitive. Also yes my intention was for it to be something you CAN do if you choose. as a way to get gold without the use of maps.

  • @anubis316 said in Sea beasts in arena? yay or nay? & crab idea:

    @weakdexx do you plan on being competitive in arena or just kinda play and have fun? maybe I just want to be super competitive. Also yes my intention was for it to be something you CAN do if you choose. as a way to get gold without the use of maps.

    It will be competive fun! I mean just for competition i aint playing. I want fun while being in a competition.

    And yes i think we mean the same about the lootcrab. Its something u CAN do but its NOT a MUST DO. So u CAN get extra gold/loot.

  • We all still have to think of this game as a pirate game and so does the appearance of sea beasts in a fight will be used by pirates to get their heads up! If a pirate fights another pirate and one has a cutlass and the other one has a pistole, the guy with the pistole wins. It is only about winning, not about how you win.

    To make this clear, it is a game and should be treated as a game. If you are unlucky, you are unlucky. This is just the case. If Meg or Kraken attack you all the time you have to deal with it or leave it.

    And to make another thing clear, using a pistole is cheating by means of what the game allows you to do. You are playing by the rules of the game, if you cheat on the rules of a clean fight. You have the possibility of doing so, this is just authentic pirate, right? Using any kind of external programme to be the winner is cheating by your own means and not by the means of the game and its developers.

    This is how I see sea monsters in The Arena. It is fair. It is the game. It is dangerous to be on the high seas and one should be ready for anything to happen.

    Best regards, Peter

  • If they are serious about making a real competitive mode, they will leave out as many random elements as possible - including the sea creatures - to keep the outcomes focused on player skill instead. Some elements are going to be random enough as is such as finding supplies without adding another element on top.

  • @anubis316

    @surveyorpete you don't think if you randomly get hit by meg 5 times out of 10 and lose each of those games because of it you will be mad?

    Sure I would. And that is why I said it would need to be not over the top. But with, say, four or five crews competing in an arena, I would be very unlucky get meg 50% of the time. Something of the order of 1 in 10 would be more reasonable.

    In any case competing in the Sea of Thieves Arena should be just that: not some sanitized empty world with no creatures, no skellies, no volcanoes, no rocks to run into, no storms, no fog and magic wind that drives every ship at full speed, regardless of the direction they want to go. Any of those may affect the outcome. And overcoming such hazards is part of the skill of playing this game.

  • @anubis316 the real monsters on the sea are those pvp griefing losers amirite?! unwanted high fives all around

    Seriously though as one of the biggest supporters of the Arena I would love to see these emergent elements. They aren't that hard to deal with, and Meg loves me and only attacks me when shes bored and has nothing else to play with. George would be a pain in the aft, though. If he traps your ship you are a sitting duck for the other crews in the match. However multiple ships being trapped would be fun and exciting to see. If you add the monsters I'd say make sure you add the loot as well that is supposed to be coming along... give the players a reason to turn in fight instead of just running.

  • @katttruewalker said in Sea beasts in arena? yay or nay? & crab idea:

    @anubis316

    Joe did mention this in the recent stream, it will be something they'll be looking at when testing with the Pioneers because it does need some careful thinking about -

    Arena - Meg, Kraken and other emergent elements?
    This type of content will be part of the iteration, but doesn't want it to feel unfair or match results are due to things out of your control but would be very cool to have these included. Needs to be tuned as to when, how often, strength of attack etc. Where the sole aim is competitive and to win also brings specific rewards, different emotions will be experienced to those in the main world.

    https://www.seaofthieves.com/forum/topic/75750/sea-of-thieves-weekly-stream-from-the-depths-13th-nov

    I get what he's saying, but Meg and Kraken are unfair by it's very nature. That's what makes them so great. A four way battle over a fort, back when we launched in March, would be completely turned around when the Kraken showed up. These natural threats are a big part of the game and those who are able to deal with said threats will be better for it.

    If you are able to survive the kraken, then that would help with your score. If Megan is after you, you could use it to your advantage by sailing towards the enemy. Effectively luring her to them. So many possibilities.

  • What about some kind of separate mode where the waters are shark (meg) infested?

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