why not!
4 players should be an option. Just like 6-8 should be for Galleon.
If the boats for like a squad is address in other games, you can have 1-5 players in most squads. you can lock the squad so just your friends join, or make it public so to meet new people.
4 Players on a Sloop
@jondeus said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
Just like 6-8 should be for Galleon.
No! Please no! That's sooo unbalanced
@mattydove74
Again you are incorrect. You said one guy can handle every aspect of a sloop and I detailed how that idea is utterly wrong.
Unless you are saying that sloops never get boarded?@deashkiin 6-8 crew option, How is that unbalanced?
what is your data to make that claim???Keeping to just a 4 player crew is continuing the same old game play. Rare seems to be making something NEW here and that means leading the way to the future of playing with friends, and not limiting their experience.
I have friends who want to play together. We will find the game that allows this options...hopefully SoT will create the wave and not follow everyone else.
Perhaps servers with only galleons of 6-8 crew could be a future option....for people with more than 4 actual friends.@jondeus It has nothing to do with trends friend. Sorry to tell you but it has everything to do with balance. A great 4-man crew is already almost unsinkable, a 5-man would be already too much, but 6? 7? 8? That's just impossible to sink even with just decent players.
Edit: Not to speak of firepower, boarding potential or even maneuverability when everyone can be on sails while still having people on canons and helm
Sloop should be 3 man max, a 3rd man would allow 1 person to stay on the wheel, 1 on cannons/repair and 1 to board or snipe from crows nest etc, a 4th man is unnecessary and would indeed be a bit too OP just in terms of always being able to have one person constantly repairing/bilging while others are doing everything else.
To anyone who claims that the sloop should stay as only 2 crew max, just because it is possible to crew it with only 2 people reasonably well if you know what you're doing that doesn't by any means make it "Optimal", 3 I feel would be the magic number where it never feels too OP but where you're also not forced to try and manage multiple things at once half the time as a 2 man crew normally would.
As far as balancing the sloop vs the galleon goes, I think the galleons crew size should also be increased to 5, which again I feel would be the most optimal amount as you could then have either 1 on wheel, 3 manning the 3 cannons and 1 on sails/repair, or 1 on wheel, 2 on cannons, 1 on sails/repair and 1 trying to board etc.
As with the notion of the 4 man sloop I think a 6 man crew on a galleon would be a bit too OP if they are well coordinated, while 5 strikes a nice balance between how many people are needed to man multiple different functions at once vs how many people are left standing around below deck ready to repair any damage the second it happens.
If they ever do add a man'o'war type ship I'd want Rare to design it for a crew of 7-8 but it would have to have certain challenges to it that requires the entire team to be well coordinated to run it effectively, for example perhaps if a part of the ship is hit by multiple cannon balls in the same spot it has a chance to replace the normal hole with a "super hole" that lets on water 4x as fast as a normal hole and requires 2 players using planks on it AT THE SAME TIME to repair it successfully.
@ch4o5bl4d3 said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
Sloop should be 3 man max, a 3rd man would allow 1 person to stay on the wheel, 1 on cannons/repair and 1 to board or snipe from crows nest etc, a 4th man is unnecessary and would indeed be a bit too OP just in terms of always being able to have one person constantly repairing/bilging while others are doing everything else.
To anyone who claims that the sloop should stay as only 2 crew max, just because it is possible to crew it with only 2 people reasonably well if you know what you're doing that doesn't by any means make it "Optimal", 3 I feel would be the magic number where it never feels too OP but where you're also not forced to try and manage multiple things at once half the time as a 2 man crew normally would.
As far as balancing the sloop vs the galleon goes, I think the galleons crew size should also be increased to 5, which again I feel would be the most optimal amount as you could then have either 1 on wheel, 3 manning the 3 cannons and 1 on sails/repair, or 1 on wheel, 2 on cannons, 1 on sails/repair and 1 trying to board etc.
As with the notion of the 4 man sloop I think a 6 man crew on a galleon would be a bit too OP if they are well coordinated, while 5 strikes a nice balance between how many people are needed to man multiple different functions at once vs how many people are left standing around below deck ready to repair any damage the second it happens.
If they ever do add a man'o'war type ship I'd want Rare to design it for a crew of 7-8 but it would have to have certain challenges to it that requires the entire team to be well coordinated to run it effectively, for example perhaps if a part of the ship is hit by multiple cannon balls in the same spot it has a chance to replace the normal hole with a "super hole" that lets on water 4x as fast as a normal hole and requires 2 players using planks on it AT THE SAME TIME to repair it successfully.
What I think you're missing here is that having enoough people to just crew all the stations all the time not only makes for dull gameplay, but removes all the skill and coordination from it.
the Sloop is fine at 2 people BECAUSE it still requires both players to jump around between helm, cannon, sails , repairs and the ocasional sniping and spotting from the crow's nest. If the sloop had another person, one could sit below decks and basically never see the light of day and that would be "optimal", and also very very boring, same goes for the galleon if it had more people onboard.
@getschmiton only 2 plz no 4 that will kill it sloops are very good they take down gallys i wont say ez but they deffs do with just 2 :)
@sir-rhavi said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
What I think you're missing here is that having enoough people to just crew all the stations all the time not only makes for dull gameplay, but removes all the skill and coordination from it.
the Sloop is fine at 2 people BECAUSE it still requires both players to jump around between helm, cannon, sails , repairs and the ocasional sniping and spotting from the crow's nest. If the sloop had another person, one could sit below decks and basically never see the light of day and that would be "optimal", and also very very boring, same goes for the galleon if it had more people onboard.
Yeah well, that's just like, your opinion, man! and if you would prefer the added challenge of managing the sloop with only 2 then you have that option by simply keeping the 3rd slot reserved and not inviting anyone to use it, but just because you personally would find it "dull gameplay" that's not really a good reason to deny that option to those would would prefer to play that way.
Personally I still find the suspension of disbelief of the crew sizes that I suggested quite the stretch given that IRL a sloop of that size would be considered operating on a skeleton crew with any less than a dozen men, but obviously this is a game so compromises are to be expected, but that said it was still the case that on a typical pirate crew each man would have their assigned roles rather than everyone jumping around doing whatever, so if there are players in SoT who are wanting to RP the pirate experience as closely as possible with what the game allows then being forced to always be operating the sloop or galleon significantly under-crewed just because some players enjoy the challenge is rather counter productive, especially as Rare has stated multiple times that they want to promote fun social experiences as much as possible, and bigger crew sizes (within reason) naturally promotes that if nothing else by virtue of having more crewmates to chat with while sailing.
@griefer-tactics said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@mattydove74
Again you are incorrect. You said one guy can handle every aspect of a sloop and I detailed how that idea is utterly wrong.
Unless you are saying that sloops never get boarded?Not by you.
I can say that we out battled and out maneuvered a sloop with no problem on the last beta. All we had to do was keep into the wind and they couldn't do anything.
If people can say a good sloop crew won't let you get into the wind, I can say a good galleon crew won't let you force them against the wind.
Besides that, a 4 man crew on a sloop means a much higher chance to hit someone.
@ch4o5bl4d3 said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@sir-rhavi said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
What I think you're missing here is that having enoough people to just crew all the stations all the time not only makes for dull gameplay, but removes all the skill and coordination from it.
the Sloop is fine at 2 people BECAUSE it still requires both players to jump around between helm, cannon, sails , repairs and the ocasional sniping and spotting from the crow's nest. If the sloop had another person, one could sit below decks and basically never see the light of day and that would be "optimal", and also very very boring, same goes for the galleon if it had more people onboard.
Yeah well, that's just like, your opinion, man! and if you would prefer the added challenge of managing the sloop with only 2 then you have that option by simply keeping the 3rd slot reserved and not inviting anyone to use it, but just because you personally would find it "dull gameplay" that's not really a good reason to deny that option to those would would prefer to play that way.
Personally I still find the suspension of disbelief of the crew sizes that I suggested quite the stretch given that IRL a sloop of that size would be considered operating on a skeleton crew with any less than a dozen men, but obviously this is a game so compromises are to be expected, but that said it was still the case that on a typical pirate crew each man would have their assigned roles rather than everyone jumping around doing whatever, so if there are players in SoT who are wanting to RP the pirate experience as closely as possible with what the game allows then being forced to always be operating the sloop or galleon significantly under-crewed just because some players enjoy the challenge is rather counter productive, especially as Rare has stated multiple times that they want to promote fun social experiences as much as possible, and bigger crew sizes (within reason) naturally promotes that if nothing else by virtue of having more crewmates to chat with while sailing.
Well, yes, it is "my opinion", and i "could" sail with 2 instead of 3 to keep the "fun" in it, but then i'd be outmatched by every other boat on the sea, forcing me to take on a third player if i want to stay competitive, and seeing as how Rare is all about horizontal progression to make sure nobody ever has the upper hand on anyone else, i'm willing to bet this is their opinion as well.
if you want to compare real life, that sloop wouldn't even be a sloop, as it is missing a sail to be a sloop, and the sail configuration is wrong.
and a boat of the scale we have in SoT wouldn't accommodate 12 people, 12 people can barely stand on the deck.Four player on a sloop is something that is making me seriously reconsider preordering the game.
I generally sailed alone during the alpha and betas, and I plan on sailing solo once the game is out; like me 1/3 of the total players sailed solo, according to the infographics Rare released.
A 4 player sloop is too OP, both for the solo/two player/s crews and for the 4 players on galeons... Also, who would chose to sail on a galeon if the sloop is easier to control and faster?
Finally, I know this is a game that has multiplayer/co-op in mind, and as a misanthrope I should avoid it... but since I really love this game so much, I'd really appreciate if devs won't make my life on the seas harder... because I can bear being a misanthrope, but not a masochistic one.
Thanks, Cap'n Ivory Bones K.Anyone promoting more than 2 crew on a sloop and more than 4 on a Galleon are incredibly discounting the enormous amount of players who want to enjoy this beautiful game as Solo Captains. They shouldn’t be forced to have to queue for larger groups to fight sloop vs sloop. Knowing that an incoming sloop can only have max 2 really allows for a fighting chance to win. Fighting a sloop that can repair, sail, and fire upon you all at the same time is completely unfair to Solo captains.
They already have enough up hill battles against veteran crews of 2 on sloops let alone 3+ Galleons...
The wonderful thing about a sloop in the sea is being able to have an engaging and fun battle of strategy and wits in sloop vs sloop, to fully know the battle ahead is as fair shot as it can be.
@Rare-Employee if looking for something to do with the brig on a sloop... let it be for capturing Bounty NPC’s or something... but don’t give the sloop 3 or more just because a brig was added to the sloop design... another thing the brig can be for is an option of a small time out being accessible for a player to vote on if their teammate has done something repeatedly that the game designers agree warrants a time-out event being able to be summoned by their crewmate.
This can't be a serious suggestion. 2 man sloop is tough enough for most 4 man galleons to handle as it is. "4 cannons vs 1 will win!" BS. Less surface area to hit and damage only gets added when you hit a new spot. Less time spent running up and down stairs with buckets, less time spent running around boarding up holes. And if you had 4 people on a sloop, you could have one guy at the helm, one guy manning the cannons, with a two person full-time maintenance crew and never sink. This idea is absolutely ridiculous.
How about the obvious too all posting in this thread?
You can have as many players on a ship you want already. You just have to trust your "FRIENDS", that are on a separate team, doesn't double cross you.
Examples:
Team 1 = Joe and Bob in a sloop
Team 2 = Smith and Wesson beached there sloop and boarded Team 1's
Or the ultimate team of my old WoW Raiding party (25) on the same Galleon. Thats every cannon manned, every deck a deckhand(repairer), Crows nest(lookout), Captain (at the wheel), Sails All (raise/lower/adjust), and about 10 Marines to board a ship if for some reason you can't sink it. (then they become divers for chests)IMO, I think they should make it everyone can kill everyone even another shipmate. Brigs are for captured enemies not crew members, and definitely not Pirates.
@griefer-tactics said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@mattydove74
See it's posts like this that earn personal insults.Posts like what? Oh you mean where you say the opposite of what you just said, then get called out on it and you flip flop once more? Yeah...
@getschmiton said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
Today during the Reddit AMA, the devs said that they were thinking of allowing more than just 1-2 people to use the sloop. Personally I'm not a huge fan of this idea due to it being unbalanced. What do you guys think?
Agreed. The whole point of restricting crew sizes to certain ships is game balance.
The downside of a 4-man crew is supposed to be that you're stuck with the significantly worse galleon to balance out the advantage of more people in your crew.
@mattydove74 said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@griefer-tactics said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@mattydove74
See it's posts like this that earn personal insults.Posts like what? Oh you mean where you say the opposite of what you just said, then get called out on it and you flip flop once more? Yeah...
I haven't once contradicted myself, you are butthurt that your myth was proved wrong. You have no way of knowing whether someone will board you or not and have to be on guard for it at all times. One person cannot out-sail a galleon, repair holes, bail water, fire cannons, adjust sails, and defend against boarders. That is an absolutely ridiculous claim and you should be embarrassed for it even crossing your mind.
@griefer-tactics said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@mattydove74 said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@griefer-tactics said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@mattydove74
See it's posts like this that earn personal insults.Posts like what? Oh you mean where you say the opposite of what you just said, then get called out on it and you flip flop once more? Yeah...
I haven't once contradicted myself, you are butthurt that your myth was proved wrong. You have no way of knowing whether someone will board you or not and have to be on guard for it at all times. One person cannot out-sail a galleon, repair holes, bail water, fire cannons, adjust sails, and defend against boarders. That is an absolutely ridiculous claim and you should be embarrassed for it even crossing your mind.
There are no boarders, you said so. 4 man sloop will wreck you, you have no concept of how to play. In fact my 2 man sloop would wreck you and I wouldn't be surprised if I could sink your galleon solo, you honestly have no clue.
@mattydove74 said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@griefer-tactics said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@mattydove74 said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@griefer-tactics said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@mattydove74
See it's posts like this that earn personal insults.Posts like what? Oh you mean where you say the opposite of what you just said, then get called out on it and you flip flop once more? Yeah...
I haven't once contradicted myself, you are butthurt that your myth was proved wrong. You have no way of knowing whether someone will board you or not and have to be on guard for it at all times. One person cannot out-sail a galleon, repair holes, bail water, fire cannons, adjust sails, and defend against boarders. That is an absolutely ridiculous claim and you should be embarrassed for it even crossing your mind.
There are no boarders, you said so. 4 man sloop will wreck you, you have no concept of how to play. In fact my 2 man sloop would wreck you and I wouldn't be surprised if I could sink your galleon solo, you honestly have no clue.
I said elsewhere that I don't send boarders, and I don't. YOU SAID one guy can do everything on a ship which is 100% ABSOLUTELY FALSE AND DELUSIONAL. Stop trying to wiggle your way out you aren't going anywhere
@griefer-tactics said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@mattydove74 said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@griefer-tactics said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@mattydove74 said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@griefer-tactics said in 4 Players on a Sloop:
@mattydove74
See it's posts like this that earn personal insults.Posts like what? Oh you mean where you say the opposite of what you just said, then get called out on it and you flip flop once more? Yeah...
I haven't once contradicted myself, you are butthurt that your myth was proved wrong. You have no way of knowing whether someone will board you or not and have to be on guard for it at all times. One person cannot out-sail a galleon, repair holes, bail water, fire cannons, adjust sails, and defend against boarders. That is an absolutely ridiculous claim and you should be embarrassed for it even crossing your mind.
There are no boarders, you said so. 4 man sloop will wreck you, you have no concept of how to play. In fact my 2 man sloop would wreck you and I wouldn't be surprised if I could sink your galleon solo, you honestly have no clue.
I said elsewhere that I don't send boarders, and I don't. YOU SAID one guy can do everything on a ship which is 100% ABSOLUTELY FALSE AND DELUSIONAL. Stop trying to wiggle your way out you aren't going anywhere
But I can, I'm sorry you cannot.
@mattydove74
Man I'd love to watch you try, especially with three cannons raking your deck. You'd be lucky to stay afloat if all you did was bail water and repair, much less trying to out-maneuver a galleon, adjust the sails, fire the cannon, etc etc
You are completely delusional and I have extreme difficulty believing you played so much as one battle. Good luck is all I can sayJust re-iterating some quick points maybe educate some in these "OP sloop" threads. Good day hope to see you on the seas :)
Also all of you think that having those extra cannons on a galleon are nothing compared to having all the crew on a sloop? you know you can't patch holes if they keep hitting in the general area you are patching in right? Also it's much easier to sink a sloop than a galleon. ANYWHERE you hit a sloop causes a hole that will create water. You hit a galleon anywhere but the bottom and they will not take on any water.
Not to mention 4 cannons firing down on you in a sloop is pretty nasty you can't manage anything if you are getting blasted by a good galleon crew that knows how to aim, 4 cannons firing stops the sloop from firing their one cannon. Can knock someone off the wheel AND can knock people back from patching. It can even knock you right off your ship and kill you. You are very exposed in a sloop to cannon fire.
With one cannon, which a crew of 4 on a galleon can manage 1 cannon firing at them pretty easily, the only way a sloop is going to sink a galleon is with boarding or boom barrels. If one galleon can't manage the cannon fire from 1 cannon, they aren't a good crew.
Plus as I said in a previous post, hitting from the back or front isn't ideal because you can only hit so many spots that cause holes. On the broadside where you do most damage, you put yourself in the position of getting yourself blown up by 4 cannons. If you are in a battle with a sloop just raise all sails sit in one spot and turn on a dime blasting them with 4 cannons just become a turret. You will turn just as fast if not faster than a sloop if you are pivoting on one spot with all sails raised. You just have to watch for boarding at that point. And even if they do try and board, just listen for them climbing the ladder, if you kill that person then there is one less person on their ship and one less person to repair their ship
@uvg-reign Just watching the first minute of that, you could already see the problem, the people in the galleon were inexperienced. 2 Guys weren't even manning cannons or sails or anything of the sort.
- One was sitting on the rear.
- One cannon firing, and missing horribly
- Not one person on the sails
- That failed board: didn't drop anchor, didn't listen for ladders, went straight for loot.
They won that engagement if the one who boarded paid attention instead of going straight for loot, this is the second time you posted a video first time was your sloop sinking a galleon due to a boom barrel. That is pure luck and can happen to anyone.
This video shows an inexperienced crew vs an experienced one. If you are going to make a point you have to compare apples to apples, crews of the same experience.
Edit still watching and they only show bits and parts of this without showing the end of these engagements. so yes my points are still valid. Not one of these ships raised their sails and turned to try and fire back, most of them were just running.
@mri1ama Youre really getting boring with your inexperience of the game and what actually happens when situations arises.
After a few holes in a galleon, its more or less crippled becuase of the crew memebers needed to stop it from sinking, causing the galleon to become ineffective if they actually try and fight back, all the while still attaining pressure from the sloop
edit: grammer
@uvg-reign My inexperience, you just make broad statements without backing it up with logical arguments lol. Think of how I feel looking at your posts that are just random "i'm right and you're wrong, oh and heres a video that explains nothing of my argument"
Yup i'm inexperienced l***o.
None of those galleons even prepared for these engagements, you can see a ship from far off, if you see a sloop coming at you. Raise all sails and turn on a dime firing at whatever side they come at. It still comes down to skill as this game usually has.
Vordmor's Sloop Vs. Enemies Galleons - Sea of Thieves stress test
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