Last night while adventuring on a brigantine we happened to come across a 2 man sloop that had a little treasure and Captain Douglas' skull. One of the sloopers asked in an "entitled" manner that we leave the relic on the dock at Plunder Outpost (since it had no worth). My crewmate told him to have a nice night (through messaging) and we continued our voyage. I told my crewmate to make him an offer. We'll return the relic if they'll clear a near by fort and give us all of the skulls the fort produces. They would make money and get their skull back. The slooper argued that we were trolling him but I didn't see it that way. Our crew would have honored the deal but the sloopers quit before the details could get worked out. This is becoming the norm for pirates getting relics stolen. At the very least instead of begging for your relic back how about making a fair trade for that relic? 4 villainous, 5 captains chests, something! Don't just throw in the towel for doing so robs you of a chance to become even more immersed within the game. Make the deals, offer deals, communicate without acting entitled! You got the relic stolen by failing to defend your ship. Be aggressive in making a deal to get it back or waste your time leave the server and start again. Relics have value to everyone concerned be it a ransom or for finishing a quest! I'm tired of hearing otherwise.
Fair compensation for a Relic.
Eh, never trust a pirate.
If i were the one man in the sloop i'd think you will rob the fort stuff after i did the kills for you and keep the skull anyway.
Seruiosly :-)
He can start the tale again and do it in nearly the same time on another server he would need to do the fort solo.We cannot force people fighting or negotiating as we cannot force people not fighting :-)
@bugaboo-bill
Couldnt agree more.
You already beat the sloop once, how does the sloop know you are going to hand over the skull? Or keep the skull and take the fort loot.Just leave the server and start again, dont feed the troll.
I do disagree with the solo fort though. Back when I was doing them, i was finishing them in 10 to 25 minutes, depending on skelly types.
There is unfortunately no good way you can RPVP with the relics.
If we have a crew with relics we stop sinking them, stop killing, even help repairing and try to convince them we wont stop their Tale.
If they keep fighting and are turned into sour loosers already although they didnt get sunk by us until, we may keep going ad they dont want to listen, but most of the time we just sail away and let them continue.I stop attacking if i see there is nothing of value for us.
If they have good amounts of captains and hatefulls and cursed chests we take it if we can.
If they are beginners with barely any loot we gift them stuff.@bugaboo-bill Then counter the offer with less. Maybe one leg of an OOS (4 skulls) that doesn't take much time. Make arrangements, " You leave Douglas in the SE tower at Shark fin and we'll leave the skulls at Isle of Lost Words".We'll pass each other peaceably to collect and form an Alliance for the rest of the night as we pass. Deal?
I think that if a crew takes the time to iron out a ransom they are most likely honorable pirates. For the immersion alone it's worth the effort! Sailing all night in an alliance wondering if the scourge of the sea that sunk you will betray their word in their first act of diplomacy with you?! That's classic good stuff! By nights end you either have a mortal enemy orrrrr a new acquaintance.
@duke-of-spire sagte in Fair compensation for a Relic.:
@bugaboo-bill Then counter the offer with less. Maybe one leg of an OOS (4 skulls) that doesn't take much time. Make arrangements, " You leave Douglas in the SE tower at Shark fin and we'll leave the skulls at Isle of Lost Words".We'll pass each other peaceably to collect and form an Alliance for the rest of the night as we pass. Deal?
In make decisions like that relaxing on the sound of your voice :-)
I can often hear where someone is coming from.To me it would be a funny experimemt maybe.
It's of course better than mute kills over and over and no interaction at all.@duke-of-spire
Why would anyone trust you? You already stole Douglas from them...why risk being burnt again?If you want positive interactions, try not stealing a worthless item from a sloop?
@pomalotacusmk3 The attitude you revealed in your response is the exact reason this game suffers concerning relics. What I'm proposing is merely a fresh way to deal with a problem. One that gives your voyage increase not decrease!
Did we know you had a relic? No!
Did we in any way dishonor our word prior to taking the relic? No!Do you have any reason to believe at this point that we won't honor a well thought out ransom? No!
The honus is on you to get the relic back. How you do so is up to you. I am suggesting that you make an offer. If you choose to quit the server that's on you. To think that most pirates won't work out a deal and honor it is absurd. The truth is the "losers" pride won't allow them to be bested. It's always someone else's fault that they lost the relic in the first place. The pvpers the trolls, the griefers, blah blah blah blah blah. The truth is that those who lose relics would rather quit, kick and scream than to fully immerse themselves into the game by tackling head on any hurdles that may come their way.
Do you quit if you get Krakened?
Do you quit if your ship gets sunk by lava rocks?
Do you quit if you lose to another player at a fort?
No.
You look for solutions! You overcome!
Is getting a relic stolen no different?
You look for solutions and you overcome Orrrrrrr you just quit!@bugaboo-bill I'm sure that in some instances there will be those that are dishonorable. For me and others like me it's far more satisfying and easier to live with ourselves by honoring the deal. I think the biggest issue in this game is both sides lack of effort in communicating.
Funny story: Last night I was on the top deck of an enemy galleon that was seconds from sinking. An enemy spawned back in front of me and I ran over and used the "make friends" emote saluting him. He responded in fashion knowing his ships fate. Now there's a class act who I will sail with in the near future!@duke-of-spire Nonsense, this is basically still just trolling regardless of how much RP nonsense you slather on it.
@natiredgals You're wrong Nati. One sides inability to strike a deal does not make it trolling. We can't help it if someone arbitrarily quits in a fit of rage over a video game. Those people might want to seek out an anger management class. What we can do though is Wheel & deal with those who are willing to embrace a new approach. You know...... A cut to the palm and a shake of the hand the way pirates used to do it! Or was that the Indians?😂
@duke-of-spire Nah its more window dressing on trolling, purposely taking a dump on someone else's time spent doing a voyage and then trying to demand that they appease you by wasting more of their time is just tripping balls on a power trip that you sunk someone. lol would my crew laugh you out of the water with that nonsense.
"Wait, you cowardly attacked us (likely with a ship devoid of loot to ante up) while we were engaged with something else and we're now supposed to do a fort for you, when we can just hop servers, leave you with something of no value to you, and put the time to serving ourselves??"
What self respecting player would ever do that? I can actually hear the laughter of myself and my friends if you came at us with that trash.
"Enjoy the relic for all the good it'll do ya", would be the answer. Maybe if you want skulls you visit the Order of souls or a Fort yourself. Ya know, generate your own loot in the world instead of being parasitic.
@natiredgals this is the funniest thing Ive read on here, props to you Nati for not taking this mean ole pirates words. I completely agree and so does my crew who I am reading this too now. He can give you all that immersion stuff, but for me, I feel most immersed when I am on this amazing voyage get the loot am about to go sell and then get interrupted by people like this lol. they straight tripping
I'm actually in agreement with the OP, @Duke-of-Spire here. I would be 1 to take him up on his offer - simply to find out. Besides, if he's offering up a free fort uncontested, that buys my crew time to come up with a counter-offensive for possible revenge if he doesn't honor his side of the deal (or we can use that time to strike early. What's to stop us from, for example, using the mega keg to blow him up?
If I was the one making the offer, I'd give the other crew an option - do the fort and we give them the relic back, or don't and they'd have to go find it at an as-of-yet undisclosed location. If they don't agree to our demands, then they will be told where they might be able to find it, but not specifically - for example, we would tell them it's on Shipwreck Bay, but not specifically where on Shipwreck Bay.
So, they can either:
- quit, as some of you suggest (which I think is in poor taste) and restart the TT all over again; or
- they can accept the offer and (hopefully) get some free loot as well as the relic back and/or time to plot revenge; or
- they can go on a scavenger hunt to a large island to re-discover their relic, which might be a fun side-track quest instigated by the players, or a wild goose chase (in which case, they're likely to find other loot).
The onus IS on the players in how they react, but as you can see, each scenario is drastically different, and tells a different story - and that is EXACTLY why I like it.
The ONLY downside I see to this is potential lost time, which the player on the receiving end might not have time for, or a distinct lack of communication (if, for example, they're in a party and can't hear the offer).
@galactic-geek He cant promise an uncontested fort, what hes offering is just more wasted time, if your goal is to complete a tall tale.
@natiredgals said in Fair compensation for a Relic.:
@galactic-geek He cant promise an uncontested fort, what hes offering is just more wasted time, if your goal is to complete a tall tale.
True, but I might make amends to that potential agreement - is he willing to protect us from other ships as we do the fort? If so, that might be an opening that we could exploit. The point of the whole thing is that it changes your expectations and opens the game to a much wider narrative of fun, exploration, and interactions that wasn't there before. This whole game is about "do you trust them or not?" That's what makes it so much fun! Sure, I might be exploited, but I might be able to exploit them too! It's all about the adventure, and an offer like that? Sounds like 1 that's off-book to me. That's the kind of thing you can't get from the TT (at least not yet). What he is doing is world-building, through role-play, and I see nothing wrong with that.
@galactic-geek Nah, its a con. Its not world building. Its just window dressing on griefing. I'm not even opposed to RP. I've done it, rarely, when a unique opportunity presents itself, but it never involves derailing another players experience.
@natiredgals said in Fair compensation for a Relic.:
@galactic-geek Nah, its a con. Its not world building. Its just window dressing on griefing. I'm not even opposed to RP. I've done it, rarely, when a unique opportunity presents itself, but it never involves derailing another players experience.
See. that's the problem right there... You THINK it's a con, and don't get me wrong, you have good reason to believe that it is, but you're taking away the potential choice that he's giving you! You're also looking at it negatively - players will already derail your experience - that's par for the course, but he is giving you MORE. Even if it turns out to be a bluff, it STILL offers additional options that I've already mentioned, like the aforementioned revenge plot.
What do you think is more fun? him straight up killing you and giving you nothing? Or him opening up a dialogue, and giving you choices that can possibly lead to enriching your story (provided you have the time for it)? Quite frankly, I know which I'd choose. In the end it's a game - you can always do the TT later, but an offer like that? That's a diamond in the rough if I've ever seen one.
But, if you want him to just kill you instead - I suppose that's your choice... But it won't be mine.
Also, the community as a whole, as well as the developers, have already established that thieving is not a form of griefing - it's expected and even encouraged.
Yea no, not buying that.
The relics have no value for a reason.
This is just a more strenuous attempt than "they have value decorating my ship" to justify disrupting other players Tall Tales.How do I know this? Because it's not, we approached these people and offered to allow them to keep the relic if they handed over everything else. Its not we "world builded" and RP to enrich their experience and ended up sinking them...
Its we sunk these guys and they didnt want to RP after so its their fault....
pure bunk.
The simplest solution here is to just make stolen Tall Tales redeemable for cash at their associated NPC, although not for as much as the actual Tall Tale reward and for no Tall Tale progress. That actually provides a reason to barter/deal/fight for your Tall Tale items, since the onus is on you to have them give it back rather than just sell it. It also indirectly makes getting the items back more likely, since you know exactly where they'll be going to cash it in (so you can fight them) and once they do, the game could just set your Tale back to the last story segment (e.g. your Briggsy's Skull gets stolen and cashed, then Briggsy pops back up just as if you first got to that part, new random island included, allowing you to proceed). It makes the theft of a Tall Tale item just a temporary set back (and an actual reward for the thieves) rather than the literal end to your Tale.
@ambiguousmonk That sounds good in theory, but I'm not sure if players actually need that extra incentive to steal from players - the very idea that a crew could not be lying when they say they've got an active TT, but also be using it as a cover for more lucrative ventures (since you can do them in conjunction with other voyages) is very interesting to me, and should remain as the only incentive needed to want to rob them.
Maybe making it a lucrative theft might be okay? I don't really know... After all, no place is safe in the SoT, so why should any 1 voyage? Right?
Well, I think the fact that they don't have value is by design, and for 2 reasons:
- as relics, they're literally priceless (it fits the narrative), and
- it encourages peace on the seas, which many have requested, since there is no real incentive to attack someone doing the TT - if you believe they have nothing of value. It also has the added benefit of ushering more PvP-minded players into the Arena.
This, IMO, was the dev's un-said compromise to players requesting PvE servers - while not entirely free of PvP (and staying within their vision), the seas are, without a doubt, a bit calmer than they were before.
@galactic-geek That's fair, but it's less about the incentive to steal from people and more about what can happen after it's been stolen.
I don't think someone saying they're doing a Tall Tale would deter a serious pirate crew from at least boarding and combing through the ship for goods. I know it wouldn't for me. Even if a person does only have Tall Tale items, I'm at least stealing their supplies every time.
In the end, you could very well be right and things are best left as they are. I'm totally fine with that. It does definitely promote peace on the seas, in a way, although I think that's still mostly Arena doing that by virtue of taking many of the hardcore PvPers away. Overall, I don't think this is something that needs to change. It's just that as a career pirate, I'd love to actually be able to do something with these darn relics besides just give them back, especially since most people attack me when I try anyway. Sometimes I'm forced to just abandon them on a rowboat or nearby island and hope they find it.
@natiredgals said in Fair compensation for a Relic.:
Yea no, not buying that.
The relics have no value for a reason.
This is just a more strenuous attempt than "they have value decorating my ship" to justify disrupting other players Tall Tales.How do I know this? Because it's not, we approached these people and offered to allow them to keep the relic if they handed over everything else. Its not we "world builded" and RP to enrich their experience and ended up sinking them...
Its we sunk these guys and they didnt want to RP after so its their fault....
pure bunk.
If I was the victim in this scenario, and doing the TT for the 1st time, I would've met their demands if I knew they had the upper hand - gold is something that I've already got plenty of and can get at any time, but to lose the TT and be doomed to repeat it, which I already have to do 5x if I want all of the commendations, would be a great fear of mine. To me, the TT has far more value in this scenario - I would dump the loot in the water (forcing them to retrieve it) and sail away as fast as I could, because even if they pursue, at least I will have bought my crew time and space to think about what to do next.
@ambiguousmonk You would leave them with their TT and with none of their supplies? That's dastardly!
You are a #truepirate. 😈
@natiredgals The truth is that we would have honored the deal. One of my old crewmates from Alpha started playing again and was 4 levels shy in OOS for pirate legend. He had enough doubloons to buy 3 of those levels. We were doing level 50 OOS as it was. So I don't want to hear "It's a con".
What I have to say about going to another server is to always remember that history has a way of repeating itself. I would rather stay on a server with pirates who are kind enough to sit down at the table and strike a deal than to take my chances of the same thing happening on a new server. I'm not telling anyone how to play the game. I'm just simply saying to keep your options open.
Rules to getting your relic back.- Don't leave in a fit of rage.
- Don't beg
- make contact through messaging or join their party chat when offered.
- Don't act entitled because you're not.
- A kind word and a sense of humor go a long way!
- Make an offer on the low side but don't be insulting.
- Be creative with your offer for who knows what kind of counter strike you could dream up while giving them 300 cannonballs and 3 pieces of Kraken!
- Have fun with the scurvy dogs for they're probably just as new at diplomacy as you are.
- Listen to their counter offers. They might be easier to acquire than your original offer.
- Try to befriend them during the process. More people have a good heart than you realize.
@galactic-geek That's my modus operandi! As one of my regular crewmates once said: "Don't mind us. We'll just peacefully take your stuff and then peacefully leave."
@duke-of-spire said in Fair compensation for a Relic.:
@natiredgals The truth is that we would have honored the deal. One of my old crewmates from Alpha started playing again and was 4 levels shy in OOS for pirate legend. He had enough doubloons to buy 3 of those levels. We were doing level 50 OOS as it was. So I don't want to hear "It's a con".
What I have to say about going to another server is to always remember that history has a way of repeating itself. I would rather stay on a server with pirates who are kind enough to sit down at the table and strike a deal than to take my chances of the same thing happening on a new server. I'm not telling anyone how to play the game. I'm just simply saying to keep your options open.
Rules to getting your relic back.- Don't leave in a fit of rage.
- Don't beg
- make contact through messaging or join their party chat when offered.
- Don't act entitled because you're not.
- A kind word and a sense of humor go a long way!
- Make an offer on the low side but don't be insulting.
- Be creative with your offer for who knows what kind of counter strike you could dream up while giving them 300 cannonballs and 3 pieces of Kraken!
- Have fun with the scurvy dogs for they're probably just as new at diplomacy as you are.
- Listen to their counter offers. They might be easier to acquire than your original offer.
- Try to befriend them during the process. More people have a good heart than you realize.
Seriously, read this very carefully and slowly.
Stuff your stupid rules man.
Like I told you before, if you came at us with that noise we'd laugh you off the server and tell you to cram the relic because it's no use to you outside of this trolling manure. Its the height of entitlement to think that you can dictate how others play. Sink my boat while I'm underground on a tall tale without talking to me first and then try to tell me how I need to respond in order for you deign to allow me to finish what I was doing? Nah man, you got no room to tell people not to act entitled. This is just the "plus" version of the lame argument that relics have value as decoration you made before. No man. there's a reason they arent for you to sell and have no value. And not everything in this game is just for you to have fun tormenting other players.
Need more money during tall tales? Pick up a shovel and earn some. You can talk about how you'd honor whatever but really if you're insisting on trying to hassle tall tale players with relics to feel like you matter you've already told me what I can expect from your honor.
Its a pretty good con, it'll fool some of the chumps, but I see right thru it, if immersion and world building and yadda yadda were what you're about y ou could totally do it without STARTING with sinking their ship. Instead you'd sink them without any of the immersion or world building you claim to want, and then blame them when they dont want to start doing RP with you after you've derailed their session. Pure unadulterated nonsense.
@duke-of-spire Short an actual argument to debunk what I said aren't we? Lol....
Nah man I'm not salty I just have no patience for intellectual dishonesty peddle that manure elsewhere.
