When playing recently, a friend and I were discussing ways we could sink a ship without a fight, sort of sneak sinking and it came to the discussion of maybe having some comical corkscrew or prybar tool that could be used to either bore holes in the side of the ship or pull off planks that were already there.
Thoughts on this?
Pry bar, boarding axe, etc... has been brought up a lot. I don't see a need for it and it would tread such a thin line between being useless or being OP that I don't think is worth the hassle.
It also makes having any kind of damaged ship more susceptible to having a tucker pull off all your bottom deck blanks.
@d3adst1ck said in Pry bar?:
It also makes having any kind of damaged ship more susceptible to having a tucker pull off all your bottom deck blanks.
Agreed. I don't know if Rare will ever add a weapon/tool that can damage ships from the interior, but if so; it should be capable of causing damage regardless of existing repairs to avoid penalizing crews that have been on the server for a long time.
You'd have to come up with a way to balance it. All the current means of sinking an unattended ship (or an unaware crew) require an audio/visual queue.
As long as it took a reasonable amount of time, thinking 50% longer than the hole it is undoing. Additionally, it would need to have a sound effect played through the duration of the prying.
My other balancing point would be that you can't use a pry bar on just any ol' spot. It MUST be on a spot that has been repaired. If the ship has not taken any damage, a pry bar cannot be used on it.
All that said, I don't really think it's a necessary addition to the game...but if they did, I'd hope balance is kept front and center.
@sweetsandman Damage once repaired is purely cosmetic or visual only. Basically, it becomes a texture. Balance issues aside, I suspect that's why this idea won't work.
Also, damaging the ship to get a hole there 1st and to wait for it to get repaired seems counter-intuitive, IMO.
I always preferred having a boarding ax that basically did the same thing as a chainshot - another way to damage the masts, wheel, or capstan. Like was already suggested though, this would also take a long time and be loud.
Another idea others have had is to be able to repair the ship to make it look like new by spending gold at the shipwright - imagine that idea paired with the OP's idea.
@galactic-geek I mean, I don't want a pry bar or a boarding axe brought to the game. I was merely planting the seed that balance needs to be of the highest priority should Rare consider either concept.
@burnbacon said in Pry bar?:
ways we could sink a ship without a fight
1-Bucket Water
2-Random Kegs
3-Steal ship and crash itPretty much everyone already does this...very sad people wanna avoid fights to sink ships.
...You can also use firebombs to create holes inside of the ship to then sink it. Which is a strategy a lot of advanced PvP Streamers tend to use when lacking a ship to immediately put holes in them.
Seems like a resounding no from everyone then...
Shame, I kinda imagined a comically obvious hand drill sort of device used for boring a hole which could be made loud and slow if needed for balance.
The idea being you could swim up to a ship and start drilling a hole in it.
I don't think it'd have too much PvP use as it'd be slow and loud, also preventing tuckers from using it secretly except while people are away from the ship.
But fair enough, I thought it'd be funny and others are not so keen, no worries.
I could see this working by doing the following:
This would add some additional consideration to loadouts when making a Boarding play and would open up more things a Boarder could try to do in regards to being a killing blow to a Ship more quickly (which could, in turn, reduce instances of Spawn Camping to see a Ship taken out). This would also promote the idea of regular care for your Ship and potentially motivate people to stop in at the Outpost more than just at Cash Out (which could also feed into people stopping in and nabbing stuff from the Quest Board while they are there to pad out a Voyage).
I think this could, potentially, have a positive impact on the day to day gameplay and be one of those smaller bits making for a bigger change to the gameplay flow that people have also been craving. Of course, my random thoughts on numbers and such might very well need some balancing but it is a place to start.
@redeyesith said in Pry bar?:
I could see this working by doing the following:
- Shipwright Repairs: For some cost of Gold you could restore a Ship at a Shipwright. This leaves a Gold Sink option, covers an often requested feature, and leaves a free method (via more work if you want to maintain Supplies) through a Scuttle.
- Boarding Axe: Treat this as a Weapon Slot suggestion. Primary Action would be to swing it that would deal less Damage than a Cutlass (say maybe 20) and maybe even a tighter Range than the Cutlass, Secondary Action would be Break that can be used on Plank Patches, Masts, Capstans, and Helms to mess up the Ship and takes both time (like the Storage Crate Transfer taking slightly longer than the Tier 3 Patch time, but opens a Tier 1 Hole) and causes a noticable noise.
This would add some additional consideration to loadouts when making a Boarding play and would open up more things a Boarder could try to do in regards to being a killing blow to a Ship more quickly (which could, in turn, reduce instances of Spawn Camping to see a Ship taken out). This would also promote the idea of regular care for your Ship and potentially motivate people to stop in at the Outpost more than just at Cash Out (which could also feed into people stopping in and nabbing stuff from the Quest Board while they are there to pad out a Voyage).
I think this could, potentially, have a positive impact on the day to day gameplay and be one of those smaller bits making for a bigger change to the gameplay flow that people have also been craving. Of course, my random thoughts on numbers and such might very well need some balancing but it is a place to start.
My only issue with this idea is that some crews (myself included) like the look of a battle-damaged ship- it shows that we kept our ship afloat despite taking a large amount of damage.
If, as I suspect, the shipwright also removed cosmetic damage, that aspect of the game would also be removed. Yes, I'm aware that we could elect to not use this service, but that would put us at increased risk from boarders.
I'm not opposed to giving shipwrights the ability to restore cosmetic damage, nor am I opposed to your suggestion for the mechanics of a boarding ax if it could break open the hull irrespective of pre-existing damage.
@limbicfanatic perhaps this could be an option made when you select that you want to Repair. Says electing that provides two options: "Fully Restore" and "Leave Cosmetic Damage" that would cost the exact same (since, mechanically they do the same thing, one option just lets you leave the battle scars around while still removing the potential for people to pull Planks).
I think a boarding axe able to remove planks on a damaged ship combined with the ability to fully repair a damaged ship at an outpost is a fair balance to this idea. The boarding axe could be used to damage the capstan, helm, or masts, or to pull planks off a damaged ship, but should be very loud while doing so and take at least as long as it does to repair.
Much of this game already relies on good situational awareness and listening closely for cues about what's going on around you to be successful, so this doesn't seem like an unbalanced fit to me. I think if Rare has added cannons to rowboats now, a boarding axe isn't a stretch to imagine being added in the future.
I would prefer a Boarding Axe or Hatchet-style weapon to be a "heavy" sidegrade to the sword, which deals more damage per swing at the cost of a longer interval between swings. The "special" attack could be a crushing, block-breaking blow instead of a lunge. Additionally, while the Sword's blocking radius could cover a full half a person, the Boarding Axe would probably only cover between 50 and 75%.
As for damaging the ship, I can see compelling arguments for and against it. Allowing a boarding axe to damage ship components would present a new opportunity for boarders, though alternatively it would be a far too powerful tool for tuckers, assuming a crew isn't already carrying Gunpowder Barrels.
As for being able to repair damage to a ship, obviously it shouldn't remove planks and holes and other functional damage to a ship. It should be a purely optional choice for pirates to pay the Shipwrights to remove the "damage" textures that are applied to the ship's hull on a hit. AKA I understand that people love taking screenshots of their ship looking like swiss cheese after a big battle, but some players like having that fresh coat of paint actually visible, and don't want to deal with all of those 2D hole textures covering it up.
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