[Suggestion] Choose Your Ship Spawn (Ending spawn-camping!)

  • There appears to be an ongoing issue with crews being able to spawn-lock a defending ship without being able to fight back at all. This mechanic suggestion will address that. I intend to propose a mechanic that will allow defending crews home field advantage on their own ship in a way that maintains the risk factor for opposing crews to board.

    The problem
    When you go from the Ferry of the Damned to your ship again, there is a loading screen and then you're immediately dropped back onto the ship at a set location. Player killers are exploiting this mechanic by placing themselves right next to the spawn point, firing their gun and swinging their sword, and effectively killing the spawning player before they have any time to respond.

    Professional players have employed this exploit so well, that anyone who is on the receiving end of it can't stand a chance. On the receiving end, the ship is 100% under the attacking crew's control.

    What is an exploit?
    In video game terms in this context, an exploit is the use of a game system to the player's advantage in a way that is not intended by the game designers. I argue that spawn-locking in this matter is an unintended side effect of an old game system that has existed since this game has launched, as it unbalances naval combat when enemy players have boarded the ship, giving them an unintended advantage.

    The solution
    I was partially inspired by the new "Hide In Barrel" emote that came with Season Two's rewards. This emote creates an advantage for the hiding player just about anywhere by allowing them to hide in a barrel. So, the mechanic I'm proposing needs to answer the question: How can we hide where the player spawns on their ship in a way that is balanced and fair?

    Suggestion
    Let the player choose where they spawn in if their ship hasn't been scuttled yet. Once the player loads back onto their ship, they are invisible and invulnerable so a player can't see or attack them as soon as they load back into the main map. The respawning player will also be muted to everyone except their crewmates. From there, they have fifteen seconds to choose where they spawn from either the sea or their own ship, removing the invisibility/invulnerability/mute. Five seconds to think and ease into the situation and ten seconds to place their avatar where they believe is the most strategic location. Whether this is in a place where they can catch the enemy off guard, or somewhere in the sea to use the environment against the enemy crew or even board their ship is up to them.

    They will also have the option to cut this timer short so they don't have to wait it out. This can allow for crews to coordinate and spawn back onto the ship together, creating another element of strategy that can turn the tide of a losing battle.

    Conclusion
    There are many players out there who have had spawn-locking happen to them, and it is a frustrating exploit that requires little to no skill in order to pull off. I understand that there will be a lot of players who welcome this suggestion and may want to provide their feedback and improve the suggestion for ways that are better than I can think of. I understand there will be a few players who dislike it and will defend the exploit. Both sides' feedback is welcome on this thread, as long as it's constructive.

    Saying something like "Git gud" isn't constructive because you can't "Git gud" at avoiding a spawnlock. Getting better at the game is something we all do over time, and as players get better, they will be able to avoid that situation by not dying in the first place.

    My main argument that this is an exploit is because the game is 100% themed on your choice in any situation. In combat, your crew and the opposing crew have a plethora of choices that they can make until one crew's ship is scuttled/sunk. That theme applies to every aspect out on the Sea, except for when a player crew is spawnlocked. Their only options are to keep trying to spawn, which is futile, or scuttle their ship to save the time, and that is something I am certain is not intended by the game's designers.

    Long post short, if you have the will to fight, you are allowed to keep fighting until your ship sinks or you give up. That is the game's high concept and theme. Under no circumstance should the enemy crew be able to put you in a position where you are essentially forced to give up, because at any time, that crew can also be at risk of losing it all.

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  • It would just be easier to give the respawning player invincibility for a second but also take away their ability to attack. This was people can’t spawn camp you, but it will also be a fair fight against skill. If people can still kill you instantly, they’ve mastered PvP, and deserve to kill you.

  • @aribalam said in [Suggestion] Choose Your Ship Spawn (Ending spawn-camping!):

    It would just be easier to give the respawning player invincibility for a second but also take away their ability to attack. This was people can’t spawn camp you, but it will also be a fair fight against skill. If people can still kill you instantly, they’ve mastered PvP, and deserve to kill you.

    It would need to be for a few seconds to allow for any players to ease in right after loading in. I could go on a debate about leaving in the invisibility, or even spawning in as a barrel or something.

  • I thought I wouldn't agree here. But on thinking about it and reading your post while I don't think I totally agree with your solution, A grace period when spawning in sounds like a brilliant idea to even the playing field.

    10 seconds immunity while loading, to ensure you have time to load in properly and move away, and you can't attack or be attacked in this time.

  • Pirate immunity during spawn-in was tested and proven to be a broken and unbalanced mechanic.

    If they can spawn-camp you, then you have already lost. It's really that simple.

  • @galactic-geek said in [Suggestion] Choose Your Ship Spawn (Ending spawn-camping!):

    Pirate immunity during spawn-in was tested and proven to be a broken and unbalanced mechanic.

    If they can spawn-camp you, then you have already lost. It's really that simple.

    If they can spawn camp you, they are exploiting the game in an unintended fashion. You could've been constructive and proposed something else. You could've agreed or disagreed with the fact that it doesn't match the game's theme.

    Be honest. Do you exploit this mechanic yourself? Because if you do, shame on you for not defending as to why it's okay to have in the game.

    If the enemy crew knows that the defending crew is going to spawn back in soon, they can't just stand by the spawn point and press the I-win button anymore. They will have to counter it by being creative. Which is how you handle every other PVP interaction in SoT.

    And if it was tested and proven, where's the proof?

  • @mageofheart5367 said in [Suggestion] Choose Your Ship Spawn (Ending spawn-camping!):

    @galactic-geek said in [Suggestion] Choose Your Ship Spawn (Ending spawn-camping!):

    Pirate immunity during spawn-in was tested and proven to be a broken and unbalanced mechanic.

    If they can spawn-camp you, then you have already lost. It's really that simple.

    If they can spawn camp you, they are exploiting the game in an unintended fashion.

    Not necessarily - they could just be ensuring that your ship sinks, or using that time to steal supplies and/or loot, or even just practicing their combat skills. The problem with malicious spawn camping (essentially killing you for no real reason other than to simply ruin your day) is that it's incredibly difficult to prove.

    You could've been constructive and proposed something else. You could've agreed or disagreed with the fact that it doesn't match the game's theme.

    I have proposed in the past that there be more spawn points on every ship so that they can't possibly spawn camp them all. I haven't agreed or disagreed with whether it fits in with the game because it's what I would call a grey area.

    Be honest. Do you exploit this mechanic yourself? Because if you do, shame on you for not defending as to why it's okay to have in the game.

    Generally no, I don't, except for the above listed reasons - to ensure a sink or to get loot and/or supplies. Unlike others though, I have not memorized spawn-in locations (and for good reason). I usually sit back and overlook a portion of the ship from an advantageous position, like the tarp of the sloop, or the stairs of the other 2 ships. That's not necessarily spawn camping (though some may argue that it is), because it offers the opposition some breathing room - at least momentarily. I do this out of fairness, and for personal combat practice.

    If the enemy crew knows that the defending crew is going to spawn back in soon, they can't just stand by the spawn point and press the I-win button anymore.

    There is no such thing as a 1-win button in this game, so don't pretend that there is. Their timing could be off, they might have a hit-reg issue, they could simply miss, or maybe they watched the wrong spawn-point. Perhaps they were outnumbered as 2 spawn-in together.

    They will have to counter it by being creative. Which is how you handle every other PVP interaction in SoT.

    This applies to both offense and the defense. Creativity breads success and amazing moments for future tales to tell.

    And if it was tested and proven, where's the proof?

    I can't say - I'm under an NDA. 😉

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